1988 Omega Seamaster Professional 200m 1441 Quartz movement REPLACEMENT

[James3]

I have a 1988 Omega Seamaster Professional 200m, (Ref. 396.1041) that once had the 1441 Quartz movement in it. I sent it back for battery service and was informed that the 1441 movement was bad! The only original part I got back on the working watch was the bracelet! They sent me everything back MINUS the Omega bracelet clasp, the watch hands and the old movement. Now I have this beautiful case without any quartz movement and want to put in a replacement quartz movement from ETA. However, nobody appears to know what movement will be needed and the suppliers reiterate that the movements are none returnable!

I wanted to know first, why do you think Omega replaced the watch case? Was it because the new Omega 1438 movement would not fit in the older 1441 case?

Second, is it even doable? Since Omega went the route and simply replaced everything, movement, case body, crown and ALL gaskets, bezel, crystal, hands and slapped on a generic clasp it has me wondering was it another money grab by them?

There must be someone that knows what movement will work with this older 1441 case!

Thank you everyone,

James

 

[SkunkPrince]

Why not rejoice that you got a brand-new watch for the cost of service and sell your parts to someone less fortunate?

Tom

 

[James3]

Because I paid MORE for the new quartz movement and case "service" than I paid for the watch when I purchased it new in December of 1988.
This is the watch that I have many happy memories wearing and I wanted to get it up and running. I took it to an Omega Boutique and they wanted between five and six hundred just to get it running. No bracelet...add another four hundred for that. I'd like to get bracelet lugs that I could attach to the case then opened up to 20 or 22mm so that I could use a strap instead of the bracelet.

 

[webvan]

So you also got back a brand new watch basically ? With a 1438 ?

It's anyone's guess why they changed the case the 1441 and 1438 are like for like, maybe it's not too late to ask them why they did that ?

As a side note the 1438 and 1538 were used in watches with the same case so you could pursue that avenue too, as well as some sister movements at Longines. I upgraded my SMP 300's 1538 with the HAQ circuit of a Longines a few years ago.

Edited: Apr 1, 2021

 

[James3]

webvan

So you also got back a brand new watch basically ? With a 1438 ?

It's anyone's guess why they changed the case the 1441 and 1438 are like for like, maybe it's not too late to ask them why they did that ?

As a side note the 1438 and 1538 were used in watches with the same case too so you could pursue that avenue too, as well as some sister movements at Longines. I upgraded my SMP 300's 1538 with the HAQ circuit of a Longines a few years ago.

 

[James3]

I was told that the 1438 that's in the new case wouldn't fit in my old case. The (2) two watch cases are different but I'm not sure how!? If you look at the 1441 case the crown enters and there are NO hollowed spaces like in the newer case with the Omega 1438 quartz movement. It would have been nice to have received the old movement back from Omega so that I'd have something to compare a new one to. I can't find anything on the 1441 other than the fact it was a thermo-compensating movement. Strange that all parts are typically returned once service is complete but not this time.

 

[ChrisN]

The 1438 you're showing above (have you opened a freshly serviced watch as you will void the warranty) is based on an ETA 255.461 as you can see that just below the coil.

The 1441 and 1438 are both based on the 1430 and all are 10.5 ligne so the diameter is the same and that's also true of the ETA. The dial feet appear to be in the same position but, it's never as easy as just changing these movements over. The 1438 appears to be visually the same as the ETA but, the 1441 has a completely different circuit.

If you want to try this, get your watchmaker to order a 255.461 as a starting point. Ask them to review whether they think this is a workable solution before the spend the money.

I don't know why Omega changed this over but there is probably a reason. If your 1441 circuit was bad, for example, they may not have a replacement. Are you sure they changed the case because the 1438 wouldn't fit? Perhaps it was for another reason?

Good luck, Chris

 

[James3]

ChrisN

The 1438 you're showing above (have you opened a freshly serviced watch as you will void the warranty) is based on an ETA 255.461 as you can see that just below the coil.

The 1441 and 1438 are both based on the 1430 and all are 10.5 ligne so the diameter is the same and that's also true of the ETA. The dial feet appear to be in the same position but, it's never as easy as just changing these movements over. The 1438 appears to be visually the same as the ETA but, the 1441 has a completely different circuit.

If you want to try this, get your watchmaker to order a 255.461 as a starting point. Ask them to review whether they think this is a workable solution before the spend the money.

I don't know why Omega changed this over but there is probably a reason. If your 1441 circuit was bad, for example, they may not have a replacement. Are you sure they changed the case because the 1438 wouldn't fit? Perhaps it was for another reason?

Good luck, Chris

 

[James3]

This watch movement was replaced on the second or third battery service at the Omega service center many years ago. These photos were taken last month at a great Omega Boutique by the tech when replacing the battery and O-Rings.
I have no idea why the case was switched. I've asked Omega but never got an answer. No idea if the movement was indeed bad and why it wasn't also returned with the rest of the parts LIKE THEY ALWAYS DO!?. They send the freaking old O-Rings back, why not the BAD movement. At least then I'd have something to COMPARE a new movements with!
It really shouldn't be as hard as Omega makes it. When I asked Omega on the phone what newer movement would work they simply said I'd have to send the case back to them to have them see the case. It's their design, surely the should know what movement goes into that case! They certainly received many Seamaster Professional 200m watches like mine back for service and didn't pull all the 1441 quartz movements out of all of those watches...DID THEY!???$$
Still confused,
James

 

[ChrisN]

You seem to be quite angry with Omega and we can't solve that, I'm afraid.

Of course Omega know what goes into each case as they have a Bill of Materials for each case with part numbers against each part. You are probably just speaking to someone who is non technical as the technical people will be busy doing work.

J James3

Now I have this beautiful case without any quartz movement and want to put in a replacement quartz movement from ETA. However, nobody appears to know what movement will be needed and the suppliers reiterate that the movements are none returnable!

I've given you the equivalent ETA movement but, you will need a movement ring for your case (the part with the cutouts). Why not give it to a watchmaker and ask them how to move forward? Any watchmaker should be able to review the movements (all the ones I listed, Omega and ETA) and work out a possible way forward, as I did. You don't need the old movement to compare as everything is written down and drawn but, you do need someone who is interested in doing this which may be easier said than achieved.

Good luck, Chris

 

[James3]

I'm not angry with Omega. I simply don't understand what the secrecy is in asking and not receiving any answers regarding repairs to my watch by them!
Also, why they cannot advise as to what movement will work. I really like this watch and just want to get it going again with another quartz movement.
I know of no watch makers in my area and the Omega Boutique wanted between five hundred to 600 hundred dollars just to get the watch working with a new movement. That's more than I paid for it new. Again, the bracelet is an additional four hundred dollars on top of that... that's why.
Thank for the well wishes Chris.
James

 

[webvan]

Yeah, we won't solve your problem with Omega here.
Having said that the reason they switched to the 1438 from the 1441 back in the day is because the 1441 was deemed to be unreliable...for some reason, like they switched from the 1445 to the 1444 too, both the 1441 and 1445 having thermocompensation and being 10x more accurate. So they probably changed your 1441 to a 1438 as part of that same process, especially since you've now clarified they did that "many years ago" something that would have helped understand this confusing situation if posted from the get go...

 

[padders]

When Omega service a fairly recent quartz watch like this, they routinely exchange the movement, they don't strip them down and service them. The keyword here is exchange, they keep your old one and install a new one. It is not necessarily like for like. In fact I would have expected them to use a 1538 here as I would have thought the older 1438 was becoming scarce like your earlier 1441. You have not been shortchanged, you just didn't understand how the process works. Omega aren't very good at explaining how they operate. Regarding the replacement case. It is possible they detected corrosion or damage than meant they couldn't guarantee a safe watertight seal, if that is the case they will always insist on a new case since otherwise they will have a liability if the watch allows water ingress. Same goes for the crown. If the original bracelet was tired and worn then again they will insist on replacement or perhaps new parts since there is a risk the watch could fall off the wrist. Last time I bought a Pre-Bond bracelet I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't more expensive, it is one of the cheaper ones, around half the cost of the Bond 1502 bracelet.

I am not sure why would you expect the service to be cheaper than the price you paid for the watch over 30 years ago. Different times.

Edited: Apr 1, 2021

 

[Archer]

padders

When Omega service a fairly recent quartz watch like this, they routinely exchange the movement, they don't strip them down and service them. The keyword here is exchange, they keep your old one and install a new one. It is not necessarily like for like.

Spot on - no big conspiracy here, just a movement exchange.

 

[James3]

Padders ~ Thank you for the feedback. The switch on the movements was done BACK in early 2012, NOT recently. I only saw "serviced movement" on the repair order but also noted that the movement notated in the header was now changed from 1441 to 1438.
I was happy to get the watch serviced and back into my possession once again. I simply DO NOT like the lack of feedback EVEN when asked of Omega. Their service is FANTASTIC! However, their ability to communicate thououghly with it's customers leaves a whole lot to be desired and definitely NEEDS IMPROVEMENT. I doubt that can be honestly denied by anyone that has dealt with that part of Omega.

 

[SkunkPrince]

I honestly think they're just too busy these days. Back in the 90s you could email the factory and ask them darn near anything and they would come through for you. Want to know when your watch was delivered and to whom? Email them the serial and they'd tell you. Now they charge for that.

But then the product line exploded with the new Seamasters and De Villes and they took off like a rocket. Likely still the same today.

 

[James3]

You are SPOT on there SkunkPrince.

 

[James3]

I don't understand what all the secrecy is over old and retired quartz movements! I'm an individual that simply wants to get his watch running again. I call Omega and it's like I'm at the pony betting window "NEXT!" I don't see the big deal.

 

[James3]

webvan

Yeah, we won't solve your problem with Omega here.
Having said that the reason they switched to the 1438 from the 1441 back in the day is because the 1441 was deemed to be unreliable...for some reason, like they switched from the 1445 to the 1444 too, both the 1441 and 1445 having thermocompensation and being 10x more accurate. So they probably changed your 1441 to a 1438 as part of that same process, especially since you've now clarified they did that "many years ago" something that would have helped understand this confusing situation if posted from the get go...

Sorry. I thought tat was clear when I stated the replacement was the 1438 movement. That was then followed by Omega's 1458 quartz movement. I believe they're both are no longer available now! That's why I was hoping for some guidance on the ETA movements as Omega owns them now.

 

[SkunkPrince]

James, I think your request wasn't clear with all of the other things around it. Correct me if I misinterpreted, but what you have is a case, dial, crown, stem, probably some hands, maybe a bezel? and you want to make a working watch out of those parts.

Is that about right? You seem otherwise satisfied with what you received from Omega service, aside from the lack of information?