I was in this auction for a Rolex Oyster Date birth year watch from 1962. The seller told me it was serviced a month ago.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Rolex-1501-Oyster-Date-Automatic-Mans-Watch-1962s-/380933176492Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

It was at $950 about 3 days ago, and $1260 last night. I bid $1285 this morning 5 minutes before the end at 6AM. I was instantly outbid and I got carried away in $50 increments until I stopped bidding at $1750, even though my watchmaker had looked at the auction with me 2 days ago and told me to stop at $1500 with a service. (Also - the same watch from 1969 sold for $1,580 on the 18th).

Then this afternoon I'm offered a "second chance" to buy it at $1750. I decided to look at the bidding history, and the 3rd highest bidder stopped at $1229. I was second and the only other "real" bidder higher than #3, as the "new" guy didn't have any other bids except the $1775. The other bidders had 2-6 entries through out the auction. I was outbid by a buyer with ZERO feedback, and I'm convinced it was a shill bidder with a very high dollar amount that he'd never have to pay. If I had stopped at $1400 I'm positive I would have still gotten the second offer email.

I'm not buying it. I'm not even offering them a second chance at $1285, the highest real bid without the Shill involved. Wise choice?

 

Hmm, smells fishy. I think you made a wise choice

 

Very wise choice!

Rather than becoming entrapped in a phony bidding war with a Shiller, have you considered using a sniping service, setting up the maximum you want to pay for a watch and letting fate do the rest?

Desmond

 

Yeah, smells shilly. You might get a second-chance offer for your max bid. I always thought this sucks. If it weren't for the 0-feedback shill bid "winner," the under bidder would have won for a lot less than the max bid.

 

I called the seller out on this, after I noticed the second chance offer came in only 6 minutes after the auction ended! I just didn't see it until this afternoon. It only took him 6 minutes to determine that the buyer wasn't going to pay.

His only response, "don't buy !"

 

Zero feedback + 6 minutes response time = 100% shill

 

If you look at his feedback history, there are many negative feedback with impolite responses.
I looked back until Dec 12, there was an Omega automatic 3510.50 sales which reported broken, after "10 more" sales of similar watch, which among buyers few did not exist anymore and a private listing , suddenly in Nov 2013 another buyer give him negative feedback for broken Omega automatic 3510.50. What is the chance that the same watch actually "shilled" for a year before somebody took the bait....and report him again.
You'd better be stay away from this seller.

 

it`s up to you. it looks worth $ 1500 to me. offer him that and have a pics. taken and sent to you with todays local paper and the watch set to 2.30 or whatever, to make sure, he has it. paypal a must with these dealings. good luck ! kind regards. achim

 

Wise choice.
Gixen is your friend.
Decide on your top price, plug it into Gixen.
Forget it until you get your email from eBay.

 

+1 on Gixen. I subscribe to their mirror service (a mere $6/yr) and I've found it works well, and has saved me more than $6. There's always the free Gixen option of course, but I like the notion of sniping at 3 sec before the auction ends.

 

Note that the "winning" bidder with zero feedback placed their "bid" on the 25th, this was clearly what in essence was a reserve set by the seller. If OPs bid hadn't gone high enough they wouldn't have received the second chance offer at all.

 

And I'm pretty sure the "reserve" was much higher than the $1775 winning bid. They just wanted to get someone like me to bid as high as they could get them to, and then offer them the consolation prize of a "second chance". There's an eBay page with a $1750 buy now button waiting for me that will expire around 6AM mtn time. I'm not taking the bait.

If I had bid $1800 which was the next level, I am sure the automatic Shill bid would have gone to $1825, and so on and so on. They obviously set a max bid that was very high and would drive people to go up and up, until they simply couldn't go on bidding anymore. But I also think I would have received a decent watch for $1400-$1500 if I had simply stopped at that point and let the Shill win at a lower price. My second chance might have paid off then. Anything less than that and maybe they'd have just delisted it?

I was sure that the battle was about to be over each time I added another $25, and then they'd counter with another $25 each time. It was automatic and instant on their part. No sooner did I bid then I was outbid. I had no idea when their original bid was placed or that they had zero feedback, until I got a second chance invite. Then I investigated the obvious "why didn't the winner take it if they wanted it so bad?" question.

Should this be reported to eBay?

 

Yes, this seller has questionable character. Buy the seller, not only the watch.

 

Definitely a shill. If you click on the user name of the "bidder" (7***y), you'll notice that the only bids ever placed by that user are for auctions by the same seller. Seven different auctions, each with one bid. Looks like the seller isn't trying very hard to hide it...

 

I reported this, but could only choose one of the reason choices that they pre-entered from a drop down menu, so the closest I could get was "listing interference". It was more like bidding interference and manipulation. They would not let me describe the issue as "Shill bidder driving price up and then offering a second chance to the next highest bidder within 6 minutes of the auction close"

 

Unfortunately, in my experience, nothing will be done. "The Bay" has little incentive to stop this behavior, since it drives prices up, and therefore auction fees. The best course of action is to continue educating users about these shenanigans so that fewer people get "taken".

 

Offer a low $1100 due to shill bidding and make sure you say thats all your offering due to shill bidding.

 

Yeah, you figured out the game and broke it down perfectly. Never accept a second chance offer. The seller is banking on you becoming emotionally involved with this watch and then being happy you're offered this miraculous opportunity to get what you've lost.

offer him 1400 bucks and leave it alone. Don't be surprised if you hear from him in a few days.

CAUTION: do not engage in any "off ebay" deals with a potential hustler.

One more general piece of advice: when buying overseas on ebay, always send follow-up messages to the seller. Ask any questions; the questions aren't important, just that you're asking them. Ebay has a deep algorithm which monitors these transaction and unless the guy is super duper level 50 THETAN power seller, they'll sequence the transaction and basically escrow your loot until you acknowledge delivery of your item.

-Rich

 

I'm not sure I want to reward the seller by making any kind of offer. If I did, it would be for the $1285 that beat out the third highest bidder, a real bidder. On the other hand, that takes it off the market so he can't pull this stunt with anyone else, at least not with this watch.

 

Yeah, I'd move on personally. This isn't the type of seller you want to hand over any significant amount of money to. Take a look at his feedback and how he responds to customers who leave even neutral feedback. Considering that the watch is in Hong Kong (and I assume you are not), you're going to be out roughly $100 for return shipping and insurance if you have to send it back for some reason. And then there's always the possibility of lost in transit. Not worth the risk, and not worth rewarding the seller as you mentioned.

Keep your eyes peeled and I'm sure you'll find something else from someone who hasn't already tried to cheat you.