What makes a watch collectible?

Nobel Prize · Apr 5, 2016

Dgercp
Can't say I agree with your analysis. Provenance can be important but the vast majority of collectible pieces have no known provenance. It
is relevant to only very few watches. Rarity, as mentioned by Tony C only has meaning for desirable or iconic watches. Popularity is not a factor for me at all, and if anything, is a negative. Also, I think trends affect price rather than collectability, while condition hugely affects collectability.

Finally, for me at least, aesthetic considerations trump everything. If the watch is not beautiful, nothing else matters.

I understand Provenance in tis context to be Historic value not only of the actual piece (let's say the "actual" Paul Newman Daytona, or Mcqueen 5512 or Astronaut X speedy) but the brand and model.

Aesthetics don't play as much of a factor to me because taste is a personal issue, and many things may be very very valuable even if they don't fit a particular Aesthetic.

Willem023 · Apr 5, 2016

froezenite
Wouldn't you say price is a reflection of collectability?

Not at all: a collectible watch might (!) have a high price, but not every very high priced watch will be collectable. That might just be a very expensive watch without having all the boxes ticked on collectability.
I'd rather go for 'scarce' and 'to fit within the rest of the bunch'. So 'collectable' is in the eye of the collector. There you go. ::stirthepot::

I happen to have a collection of some other stuff: the collection as a whole is what you might call 'a very unique collection', whereas the individual pieces are 'nice and sought after', but not extremely high priced.

pitpro · Apr 5, 2016

1.The price rising.
2. see #1.

cimo · Apr 5, 2016

Dgercp
Can't say I agree with your analysis. Provenance can be important but the vast majority of collectible pieces have no known provenance. It
is relevant to only very few watches. Rarity, as mentioned by Tony C only has meaning for desirable or iconic watches. Popularity is not a factor for me at all, and if anything, is a negative. Also, I think trends affect price rather than collectability, while condition hugely affects collectability.

Finally, for me at least, aesthetic considerations trump everything. If the watch is not beautiful, nothing else matters.

It is true that provenance only is relevant for a select few pieces. But having that provenance is what makes them "more" collectible than the equivalent watch without history, which is why it is at the top of my list.

While popularity may in fact be a detractor for your selections, all one needs to do is look at the price of vintage speedies over the last few years to see how popularity plays a factor. You and I may both disagree with people who collect watches in this way, but the "Hodinkee effect" is a real thing.

Willem023 · Apr 5, 2016

cimo
people who collect watches in this way

Agree, but then the question might be: what IS a collection or how to define that. People buying stuff because the price is -expected- to rise, are they collectors, or merely enthousiasts gathering stuff to re-sell in future? And if so, does that matter?
My personal view: try to find the best that appeals to you and fits in with the rest (theme included). I would never, ever buy because of expected gain. So, rising popularity of anything is a non-decisive element if I consider buying.
So happy I am not influenced by the Hodinkee-effect... ::psy::

Dgercp · Apr 5, 2016

cimo
It is true that provenance only is relevant for a select few pieces. But having that provenance is what makes them "more" collectible than the equivalent watch without history, which is why it is at the top of my list.

While popularity may in fact be a detractor for your selections, all one needs to do is look at the price of vintage speedies over the last few years to see how popularity plays a factor. You and I may both disagree with people who collect watches in this way, but the "Hodinkee effect" is a real thing.

I agree fully that popularity affects PRICE, but for the real collector of anything, I think popularity plays a minor role. Maybe we are just talking semantics 😀

Willem023 · Apr 5, 2016

Dgercp
alking semantics 😀

Being it for a senior project, that might fit...🍿
Make them think!! 📖📖

Optimizer13 · Apr 5, 2016

Although having all factors (originality, provenance, condition, aesthetics) will only make it more collectible, I have to agree with the people above that prioritizes aesthetics. To me, if a watch looks ugly (clearly subjective) I couldn't care less whether its rare, original, cheap, was worn by some famous person, etc. Also, @pitpro may be half joking but its true to some extent. How many of you will buy vintage watches if they depreciate every year? I would still buy my grails because I truly like them but no doubt it will reduce collectibility of many other vintage watches that I was just trying to "check it out."

cimo · Apr 5, 2016

This brings up an interesting chicken-or-egg type question. Is a watch expensive because it is collectible or collectible because it is expensive?

At first glance I am inclined to say the former, but the more I think about it the more the latter demands consideration too.

VetPsychWars · Apr 5, 2016

You want to sit it on a shelf and stare at it instead of using the damn thing as dog intended!

A "collection" is curated, and it has a point. Items of lesser condition or rarity are traded out for better condition or more rarity. Originality is preferred. A collector fancies himself running a tiny museum and holds some of the same principles.

Talk is of saving the object for future generations rather than use it as dog intended!

For example... Model of 1911 or Model 1911A1 Colt pistols. Points are awarded for original condition with original finish. Anything that would wear the finish? Forget it. That piece goes in the gun safe. Their thinking goes, you can get a new pistol that shoots the same or better, why would you risk ruining the good pistol by shooting it?

Back when you shot film instead of digital, I used a Kodak Retina rangefinder... in itself, collectible. Then you get started on the lenses (very high quality Schneider-Kreuznach) and then the accessories. By the time you built up a decent kid, you've spent a buttload of money because you competed against the collectors for the good specimins.

I have a laugh at you guys talking about Speedmasters. Your DON bezels. Chocolate. My favorite is "tropical", not that it actually means anything having to do with the tropics. Old, clapped-out bracelets cost a thousand dollars. Stuff like that.

Ultimately what makes something collectible is that the thing is somewhat scarce and people want it and will pay for it. Scarcity alone won't do it... has to be scarcity and desirability. Once you reach that point, someone will definitely set the thing on a shelf to venerate it instead of use it as intended.

Tom

Willem023 · Apr 5, 2016

Optimizer13
How many of you will buy vintage watches if they depreciate every year?

Actually, I do not care.

At all.

I always tell my nephews and nieces (oh dear, I am 'that uncle' 😗 ) that the best thing they can do if I die, to have a big bonfire and have a ball. Preferably with good food and plenty of fine wines.

Optimizer13 · Apr 5, 2016

Its collectible if it looks like a Rolex Daytona ::stirthepot::

Just kidding... half kidding...

Taddyangle · Apr 5, 2016

pitpro
1.The price rising.
2. see #1.

I stopped buying used modern Omega, these prices appear to be very slightly declining over past 18 months.

arkstfan · Apr 5, 2016

I think we could sit down and name a number of watches that have reason to be interesting and are not in hugely abundant supply that are not deemed collectible simply because no one has seen one sell for a few thousand or even a few hundred dollars.

Jminchoi · Apr 5, 2016

Taddyangle
I stopped buying used modern Omega, these prices appear to be very slightly declining over past 18 months.

@pitpro point proven 😉

mokofoko · Apr 5, 2016

STANDY
Same reason you think the pretty chics at university are pretty and the not so are not so.

Thats how i pick......

And what if said pretty lady is wearing a horrible watch? Will that affect the appeal of the lady or the watch?

vintagelady · Apr 5, 2016

How interesting; I was just thinking about this today...

I'm on the hunt for an antique or vintage (circa 1890-1940) Omega pocket watch as a birthday gift for my dad - he's turning 73 this year, and as long as I can remember, he's worn a pocket watch. Ironically, he knows absolutely nothing about watches (although I'm far from an expert, myself). As I was searching, I also did research and price comparisons...etc. I had a budget, but want it to go as far as possible, as we all do. So I started with solid gold cases (14k and 18k). After I narrowed down some possibilities, I began comparing movements (15j-17j vs 24j), then size comparison, and so forth. Halfway through the process, I came to the realization that none of the contenders were anything my dad would like: he doesn't like yellow gold/yellow finishes, open-faced pocket watches or busy faces/dials. I think perhaps there are two collectors: the "museum curator" that collects, catalogues, cleans and carefully stores, and the "enthusiast" that is equally as educated but enjoys wearing and using the watch as much as (or more than) than the market value of it. I approached the pocket watch as the first collector, since I never considered myself using one - but I know my dad would be the second. I was thinking, "What's worth more, an open-face, half hunter or full hunter?", when it didn't really matter. What's most important is what my dad prefers and what he would wear.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that "collectible" can have two meanings/markets: one for the person who puts more importance on the numbers and one for the person who cares more about the aesthetics and if it would be something he or she would really use. I am assuming, of course, that both these hypothetical people care equally about quality, material, condition, age, movements...etc. I wear a vintage 1960's 14k ladies Omega, and while I did exhaustive research on that specific piece before buying (i.e. authenticity), I have no idea how "rare" it is (I don't think it's particularly rare, although mine turned out to be in fabulous condition if not a bit dirty) and I wear it every day. As for my dad, I'm about to pull the trigger on a circa 1923 800 silver full hunter Omega.

Not sure if that was helpful, but that's my 2 cents!

longhornbba · Apr 5, 2016

For me, it's mostly story. Along with that is the potential for sentimental value, which is hard to quantify.

froezenite · Apr 5, 2016

vintagelady
How interesting; I was just thinking about this today...

I guess what I'm trying to say is that "collectible" can have two meanings/markets: one for the person who puts more importance on the numbers and one for the person who cares more about the aesthetics and if it would be something he or she would really use. I am assuming, of course, that both these hypothetical people care equally about quality, material, condition, age, movements...etc. I wear a vintage 1960's 14k ladies Omega, and while I did exhaustive research on that specific piece before buying (i.e. authenticity), I have no idea how "rare" it is (I don't think it's particularly rare, although mine turned out to be in fabulous condition if not a bit dirty) and I wear it every day. As for my dad, I'm about to pull the trigger on a circa 1923 800 silver full hunter Omega.

Not sure if that was helpful, but that's my 2 cents!

It is helpful, thank you.

froezenite · Apr 5, 2016

At first I was planning on focusing on more mainstream collectible watches (Speedmasters, Daytonas, Tri-Compax etc.) but after reading all your posts I think I need to broaden my definition of collectibility. It sounds like for many of you, aesthetics are very important but it is rather difficult to find evidence as aesthetics are very subjective. I guess I could cite forum posts as evidence that aesthetics are important.

Thank you to everyone who helped me today. I am glad to know that there is a helpful community out there that will take time to answer a couple questions.

-SWK

What makes a watch collectible?

Nobel Prize

Willem023

pitpro

cimo

Willem023

Dgercp

Willem023

Optimizer13

cimo

VetPsychWars

Willem023

Optimizer13

Taddyangle

arkstfan

Jminchoi

mokofoko

vintagelady

longhornbba

froezenite

froezenite

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