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  1. Professor Dec 18, 2017

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    Hi

    Been gathering in cases , Movements, etc to assemble a couple or three watches this spring and summer. Along with tools for same.

    I'm not having any luck finding either suitable dials or hands specific to the movements I have, a 138.311 and a ST96 4. Both are calendar date only.

    I'm a bit lost with some of the nomenclature and so far the manual downloads for the movements I've found are all in French. I probably should babblefish the specs one word at a time till I find the proper dimensions both in millimeters and in thousandths of an inch but I'm hoping for an online source that can explain at least most of what I need to know.

    The sources I have found give only a rough idea of such things as mounting a dial.
    I've replaced popped off hands in the past and will be getting proper specialized hand arbor and removal tools soon.
    Taking internals out of cases and replacing them has been simple enough.

    There are online stores that offer quite a few choices of hands and dials but seldom if ever do these give the complete dimensions and they seem to go by brands rather than movement ID numbers.

    Found some really beautiful NOS Heri Sandoz complete cases with dials dirt cheap but no mention at all of the movement or interior dimensions and those with calendar windows looks to be for both day and date.

    BTW
    What the heck is that weird logo on the Henri Sandoz case backs? Looks like a man being swallowed by an octopus while swinging a hatchet at a dog.
     
  2. Canuck Dec 18, 2017

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    I’ve never been to the big watch show that is held in Switzerland each year. But in my view, if you are serious in your venture, and are planning to generate enough revenue from your venture to make the trip feasible, that would be where you would need to go. One stop shopping, so to speak, for movements, dials, cases, fitments, etc. If you are only trying to do one or two “custom” watches, best of luck. Let us know how you make out.
     
  3. Professor Dec 18, 2017

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    This is a not for profit hobby.
    I've found one site that sold Swiss made make your own watch kits but the shop seems to be out of stock or perhaps out of business entirely.

    I missed out on a free trip to Switzerland back in the nineties. Would have been nice but I let my mom have my spot and took over caring for my terminally ill brother for awhile to give her and my sis a well earned vacation.
    Still have the photos of mom at the Matterhorn. She brought me a Swiss army pocket knife. I didn't have the heart to tell her I could have bought the same knife here for less.

    The few videos I've found so far that show a dial being mounted to a movement are too poorly done to see exactly what is being done.
     
  4. Canuck Dec 19, 2017

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  5. FREDMAYCOIN Dec 19, 2017

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    You could also try Jules Borel. good luck
     
  6. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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  7. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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    I'll check them out as well.
     
  8. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Dec 19, 2017

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    Like I said in the last thread you posted on this subject, it will be a learning experience for you. It looks like that experience has started...it's never as easy as people imagine it to be...
     
  9. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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    Found a quote from a ST96 -4N data sheet in English.

    FHF 96-4N

    Features
    manual wind
    sweep second
    date: set by changing 20:30-24h

    Data
    11.5''', Dm= 25.6mm, Do= 26.0mm
    H= 4.5mm
    F= 1.5mm
    T= 2.1mm
    17 jewels
    f = 18000 A/h
    power reserve 48h

    Balance staff
    U3045

    Stem
    W2650

    Main spring / battery
    Zf1328, 1.60 x 11.0 x 0.12 x 350mm

    Hands
    1.30 x 0.90 x 0.21 mm

    So I guess that solves the hand dimension question for that movement.

    Still need one for the smaller 138.311 movement.

    I think the 138.311 takes a dial of circa 26 mm, but not entirely sure. The movement is about 2 mm smaller than the ST 96.

    Ofrei. seems to have mainly 26 mm and 28.5 mm dials.

    I'll have to wait till I can measure the cases I get before being sure. One I already ordered for the 138.311 appears to have the correct internal dimensions including positioning/retaining ring.

    I'm not planning on anything fancy. Other than handmade bands these will look pretty much generic. I might have the back plates engraved.

    PS
    I have no illusions about this being particularly easy. I do have the necessary skill level to get the job done. My doctor once tried to get me interested in going to medical school to become a surgeon because my hands were so steady. that was forty years ago. They aren't quite that steady these days but I'm getting back in trim.
     
    Edited Dec 19, 2017
  10. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Dec 19, 2017

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    If that information is from Ranfft I would double check it with an independent source before proceeding...
     
  11. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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    I'll take your advice.
    I'm expecting that the ST96-4 movement I have will need oiling before i put it to use.
    It looks perfect and starts right up when wound, but it had been sitting unattended for forty years before being put up for sale. I'll be studying you posts on this sort of thing.
    The 138.311 is still in its factory plastic casing, got no idea how long its been there.It also starts right up, but may need fresh oiling. I suppose a watch specific silicone oil would be called for.

    PS
    I wish I'd held onto that purified whale oil I had many years ago.
     
  12. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Dec 19, 2017

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    It needs more than oiling - it needs to be fully disassembled, cleaned properly, reassembled, and oiled.

    In terms of movements being in "plastic casing" if you mean this sort of thing:

    [​IMG]

    That does not protect the movement at all really. To have a movement that is ready to use after years of storage requires it to be in packaging like this:

    [​IMG]

    As you can see the foil pack is filled with inert gas to prevent oxidation of the oils over very long term storage:

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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    I could have ordered the 135.311 still in the foil package. Apparently they had opened one just to be sure they were in good condition. I'm pretty sure this one had not been open for very long before being put on the block.The only reason i ordered one that had already been opened was the psychological draw of being able to see just what I was buying and knowing it had already been tested and was in working order. They have more available at the same low price still in the foil packs.
    I think they called the plastic drum a transfer case. There are small round openings , probably for inspection while running,so its not air tight.

    Neither movement shows any sign of degradation. The ST-96 was in a long closed up workshop of a deceased watch maker. It looks to be plated with either gilding metal or gold and is clean as a pin. No corrosion visible.
    No dust so probably packed away somehow.
    Everything turns freely so there's no noticable caked up residue to be cleared away.
    I'd rather not disassemble the 96 completely unless I absolutely have to.
     
  14. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Dec 19, 2017

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    This is where doing the job right or just slapping something together gets decided. Just a hint but putting a movement in a watch that has been "sitting unattended for forty years before being put up for sale" is not doing the job right...but hey, it's your project mate!
     
  15. Professor Dec 19, 2017

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    Well you've convinced me so far as the 96-4 movement goes. I will put it aside till after I finish the 138.311.
    Id originally only bought the 96 intending to strip it to use the regulator assembly on another 96 movement. I may go ahead with that.. I've not yet obtained a case for it anyway. The entire movement cost far less than a regulator assembly by itself.
    I've found some NOS 96-4 movements at a reasonable price, I'll look into those before using this type of movement.

    Since these will be for my own use, and are mainly just for practice any way, I have more leeway than if I were building these to sell.