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Watch accuracy vs reserves

  1. bill5959 Jan 2, 2015

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    Happy New Year friends. :)

    I have been wondering about a couple of vintage watches I have that keep good time but that have a poor reserve. 12 hours or less. One is a Valjoux 222 and the other a Lemania 5100. Both are off to the watchmaker on Monday, but I wonder if this a particular indication of a particular issue with a watch movement? Regards, Bill
     
  2. bill5959 Jan 2, 2015

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    Correction. The Valjoux is not an automatic, but does run accurately for a period of time. Sometimes I don't even understand what I say. ::facepalm2::
     
  3. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Jan 3, 2015

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    Proof that timekeeping is not an indicator that a watch does not need service...there are lots of parts inside a watch that are not directly related to how well it keeps time.

    I try but the myth persists...

    Cheers, Al
     
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  4. bill5959 Jan 3, 2015

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    Thanks Al. Perhaps you should go on myth busters. I've found two schools of thought, yours and the one that says a watch running well doesn't need to be serviced. The latter doesn't make sense to me, but I do hear from otherwise sane(?) people that it is so.
     
  5. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Jan 3, 2015

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    Well here is a good example...this watch came to me for a regular service only because the owner had bought it within a few months of sending it to me, and said she didn't know the service history, and wanted to be safe. The first thing I did before even opening it was to check the timing - it has an ETA 2824-2 inside:

    [​IMG]

    Balance amplitudes are not horrible by any means, Delta is quite good, so it looks okay and confirms what she said that it kept time well on her wrist.

    Then I opened the case, and removed the automatic winding module, and here is the first indication that something is seriously wrong:

    [​IMG]

    Debris all over the movement...I removed the movement from the case continued with the service. When I removed the crown wheel from the barrel bridge, here is where you can see the wear:

    [​IMG]

    But that's not the worst of it - on the main plate the winding pinion had been wearing away the plate as you can see here:

    [​IMG]

    Top view shows how deep those grooves go:

    [​IMG]

    Remember the owner of this watch was not having any problems with it. I replaced the barrel bridge and the main plate, and that doubled the cost of the service.

    People who maintain their belief that if nothing is broken don't fix it can believe what they want, but just because it's running well does not mean it isn't wearing itself out somewhere inside.

    Now just to be clear I'm not arguing that one should keep rigidly fixed service intervals. My answer to how often a watch should be serviced is always the same: "It depends." There is no policy that works for every situation, so my advice for servicing a Cal. 321 Speedmaster and an 861/1861 Speedmaster will be different. My biggest problem with people giving their opinions on this in watch forums is they seem to think their advice is appropriate for all situations, and it isn't. In some cases it makes the best economic sense to just let the watch run until it stops, then pay for all the parts to be replaced. It depends on the manufacturer of the watch, how much the parts cost, how available they are, who you use to service your watch, and if you can stand wearing your watch knowing it's grinding itself up inside.

    Okay off my soap box...for now anyway.

    Cheers, Al
     
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  6. alam Jan 3, 2015

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    Al, this is just for grins and if you don't mind.....approximately how many watches you service in a year? Of these, what percentage of watches the owner has preventive maintenance or routine service in mind versus a dead watch or with specific malfunction, e.g. chrono not setting?

    P.S. as always, good information you provided above...
     
  7. bill5959 Jan 3, 2015

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    Al, I may now be down to two watches I can wear:unsure: At least that have any value. Off to Ebay to find a nice Timex…….
     
  8. flyingout Jan 3, 2015

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    So, if I may, what is your advice for a 321 Speedmaster? I have not been good about regular servicing, just now having the whole collection done. But most of those are modern pieces.

    But I realize my new 321 Speedy is different and parts need preserving. So are we talking even shorter intervals, or the usual 5 years? I do plan to wear it.
     
  9. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Jan 4, 2015

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    I would not go over 5 years for sure even if it is not worn a lot. If worn daily I would be looking at possibly shorter then that - maybe 3.5 to 4 years.

    Sorry hit the button too soon, so editing to add that I have seen brand new modern watches, worn hard, that were totally trashed in a 5 year period. It really depends on how you wear the watch.

    Cheers, Al
     
  10. flyingout Jan 4, 2015

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    Siri, remind me to PM Archer January 2019.
     
  11. GrouchoM Jan 4, 2015

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    Nasty, scary photos, Al. I'm glad you're a watchmaker and not a surgeon posting ugly surgical photos or I'd lose my lunch.