Tudor 76100 - authentic? sort of maybe?

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Hi all,

I’m looking at picking up a Tudor Submariner ref. 76100 and would really appreciate some opinions on authenticity and correctness that are better than mine. It's dancing between "that's a really good deal" and "too good to be true" depending on how much is authentic.

I'm planning on picking it up in person so I'll have a chance to inspect it up close and see the serial # engraving before handing over the $.

Here are the details and disclosures so far:
Seller states the bezel insert (and maybe bezel) is aftermarket.
Bracelet is not genuine.
Hands are probably service replacements.
Case, dial, and crown look period-correct to me, but I’d love some confirmation.

Particularly I am concerned about the caseback, movement, and the case itself; the case looks too nice for a 40+ year old watch. I'm ok with it having been polished.

I’m aware service parts are common on these, but I want to be sure I’m not walking into a counterfeit or replica-based frankenwatch. Any insights from those familiar with the 76100 would be hugely appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
-jeremy

 
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Hi Jeremy:
Have a bump on me. No expert here, but understand the plight of dealing with the vintage minefield. It's certainly attractive, but I too would be interested to hear any expert opinions on the parts. Glad you're able to see it in person and looking forward to hearing the outcome, and what your gut tells you when you handle the watch.
 
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Not the biggest expert but that caseback inscription looks off. Also the rotor smells. All IMHO so happy to be corrected
 
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Not the biggest expert but that caseback inscription looks off. Also the rotor smells. All IMHO so happy to be corrected
Thanks for the input, I'm even less of an expert so I appreciate it.

I've been crash-coursing on c24, Reddit, Ebay, etc. and this is what I have found out so far - but I don't have great faith in my research skills.

The casebacks are all over the place on this reference. The outside engraving on this one seems to match about 1/5 of the ones I've seen so far. The inside engraving is even more varied. I think I'm going to have to just use a good loupe and trust my judgement on the engraving quality / placement / font.

The rotor seems iffy to me as well. Still digging, but it appears that could be a service rotor. The shock absorber in this appear to have been changed from novodiac (or maybe KIF) to Incabloc. Which lends equal credence to it having been serviced or frankenwatch, so not super useful in authenticating XD

-jeremy
 
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If the movement has the wrong shock protection device it's likely a repro/fake watch.
 
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If the movement has the wrong shock protection device it's likely a repro/fake watch.
The movement is an off-the-shelf ETA 2824 with custom rotor it appears. The top shock jewel could have been 'swapped' as a part of a balance swap, or the movements could have changed as the model developed. "Mid tier" brands in the 80s and 90s have some BAD examples of 'lowest effort possible' around an ETA movement, so it wouldn't shock me (hah!) if they just ended up with a different shock option along the way.

Additionally, since at the time this was a mid-quality swiss watch (I'm being somewhat generous, a lot of these were mall-watch tier at the time), a watchmaker wouldn't care about swapping in a non-Tudor part with a common part.

I had a Tissot I spent a TON of time tracking down replacements for (actually using the 2824 as well, which is a LOW quality ETA movement, basically their bargain bin movement), since even most parts watches had unlogoed replacements. I got fortunate to find an absolute basket case that ended up having the right top plate I needed.
 
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Before purchasing my 79090, was also looking at 76100 examples, I was lucky enough to have a well respected local source walk me through the tell tale signs of a counterfeit one of these. And I spent many hours studying possible fakes and legit examples before purchasing my Tudor Sub. Members here were also very helpful when I posted one that also turned out to be a counterfeit. Check out the thread here.

It’s late here so I a bit tired to explain all the issues I see with this example, but let’s just say my spider senses are pulling the fire alarm on this one. I’d steer way clear of it. I’ll note some of what I see below.

  • Bezel insert is definitely a repro
  • Submariner and depth font are way off. Actually dial typeface all around looks off.
  • Rotor finishing is off
  • Shock type and movement cal font is concerning
  • Caseback engraving typeface looks off. Caseback also looks to be too thick.
  • Width of the minute hand seems off as well.
  • Hour hand on a 76100 should be a snow one but many of those didn’t make it through the years.

Wish I had better news. Good luck with the search though, I’m a fan of the example I know have, it’s a wonderful reference and I wear my 79090 pretty much every day.
 
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Before purchasing my 79090, was also looking at 76100 examples, I was lucky enough to have a well respected local source walk me through the tell tale signs of a counterfeit one of these. And I spent many hours studying possible fakes and legit examples before purchasing my Tudor Sub. Members here were also very helpful when I posted one that also turned out to be a counterfeit. Check out the thread here.

It’s late here so I a bit tired to explain all the issues I see with this example, but let’s just say my spider senses are pulling the fire alarm on this one. I’d steer way clear of it. I’ll note some of what I see below.

  • Bezel insert is definitely a repro
  • Submariner and depth font are way off. Actually dial typeface all around looks off.
  • Rotor finishing is off
  • Shock type and movement cal font is concerning
  • Caseback engraving typeface looks off. Caseback also looks to be too thick.
  • Width of the minute hand seems off as well.
  • Hour hand on a 76100 should be a snow one but many of those didn’t make it through the years.

Wish I had better news. Good luck with the search though, I’m a fan of the example I know have, it’s a wonderful reference and I wear my 79090 pretty much every day.
Thank you so much. Your "a bit tired" analysis beats my "spent 30+ hours trying like hell to become an expert"

at 1200$, I know it was too good to be true. I was just hoping that the dial (and maybe the case) was genuine and I would've been happy starting a great project piece.
 
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Thank you so much. Your "a bit tired" analysis beats my "spent 30+ hours trying like hell to become an expert"
No worries and happy to help where I can but no expert here, just very much an enthusiast of the Tudor Submariner references. I've been lucky enough to be a part of this wonderful forum for going on 4 years now, and owe countless saves and near catastrophies being averted by the help of more experienced members. So, if I can repay some of their generosity with some observations to your inquiry, I'm more than happy to do so!

at 1200$, I know it was too good to be true. I was just hoping that the dial (and maybe the case) was genuine and I would've been happy starting a great project piece.
Best advice I could give after being burned a few times, bought the placeholder watch, etc. is to save up or sell whatever I can to have the funds to purchase my favorite example of the reference I'm eyeing. Doesn't need to be the most collectable or pristine version, unless that's what you'd like to find, but one that you like all the characteristics of the watch in the state it's being offered.
 
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No worries and happy to help where I can but no expert here, just very much an enthusiast of the Tudor Submariner references. I've been lucky enough to be a part of this wonderful forum for going on 4 years now, and owe countless saves and near catastrophies being averted by the help of more experienced members. So, if I can repay some of their generosity with some observations to your inquiry, I'm more than happy to do so!


Best advice I could give after being burned a few times, bought the placeholder watch, etc. is to save up or sell whatever I can to have the funds to purchase my favorite example of the reference I'm eyeing. Doesn't need to be the most collectable or pristine version, unless that's what you'd like to find, but one that you like all the characteristics of the watch in the state it's being offered.
if you don't mind, could I ask you opinion on these? The seller got more photos.

 
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So sorry for the delayed response.

Reference Number Case Engraving:
- There’s something off with the font for my eyes. But I would look at a few examples for your info. Here are a few from sources I have found knowledgeable on these. One, Two, & Three. Bonus.


Dial Supplier / Maker mark:
- I haven’t ever looked into who made the dials from these so I would say I can really weigh in on this area. To try and help I did a quick search but I couldn’t find any sources I’m familiar with noting Beyeler as the producer. Only dial I came across with that stamp was an earlier reference. Not saying it isn’t legit, just that I could find anything linking them.
 
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So sorry for the delayed response.

Reference Number Case Engraving:
- There’s something off with the font for my eyes. But I would look at a few examples for your info. Here are a few from sources I have found knowledgeable on these. One, Two, & Three. Bonus.


Dial Supplier / Maker mark:
- I haven’t ever looked into who made the dials from these so I would say I can really weigh in on this area. To try and help I did a quick search but I couldn’t find any sources I’m familiar with noting Beyeler as the producer. Only dial I came across with that stamp was an earlier reference. Not saying it isn’t legit, just that I could find anything linking them.
I really appreciate all the knowledge you're bringing here, it's been incredibly helpful. It looks like Beyeler did manufacture both OEM and service parts for Rolex and Tudor before being acquired by Rolex. The markings are quite different on the few examples I found on ebay and such. The case engraving does have suspicious spacing and the "7" doesn't looks quite right. This era when so much was done by hand does have a lot of variance and I'm just too unfamiliar to be confident.

Thanks again for weighing in and answering my questions