Saw this watch on the 'bay. Got in touch with the seller, who seemed to be a legit dealer or semi-dealer and whose feedback was strong, had some discussions, and made a deal. Sent the funds and followed up every day asking if the seller received the funds. No response for SIX days running. I was getting a bit freaked and retracing the deal to see what was amiss. Finally the seller responded that he was sending the watch. Big sigh of relief. Then five days of shipping (from France). Today the box arrived. All's well that end well (even though I did a lot of rethinking as to who to buy from during this transaction). Best to all. Nick
A Type XX is always worth a little trouble but that sounds quite stressful. I get less and less enthused about sticking my neck out the longer I do this....gotta protect the coronaries!
Do you have a source for the missing movement parts? Glad the seller came through on the shipment! Cheers, Al
I just bought a 68 transitional off a dealer on chrono24 .... When watch arrived the dial was painted not applied logo and chrono did not work....totally different watch then picture... Just got money back today... After 5 weeks of harassing chrono 24 ... Pissing my pants the whole time... I too am rethinking who I deal with and how I pay...glad things worked out...nice piece... Not familiar with brand... Can you tell us more
To my understanding, the Type 20 and 21 watches were made for the French air force in the 1950s-1970s. They are typically issued military pieces, and the “fg” (fin de garantie) markings on the caseback indicate service intervals or expirations. The watches have Valjoux movements and a flyback chronograph function. The steel case measures 38 mm, without counting the crown, a screw-in back, and a bi-directional steel turning bezel. I believe that the original Type 20 (or XX) was made by Breguet and they can be found, but the prices are high and there are a lot of Franken pieces. These watches were also made by or branded Airain, Doxa and Auricoste (one has appeared recently here in the FS board). The Airains are very similar and may have come from the same manufacturer (mine is below). I like them for the simplicity and the history. What other issued vintage military chronographs can be had for anywhere near the price point (and a fraction of the price of a '60s Speedmaster, as an example)? Some other members have similar pieces and that helped pique my interest. From my experience the watches are hard to find in the US but available in Europe with modest patience. Others can add more.
The Type 20/21s were in active use in service over several decades from the mid-50s through the early '80s, and there are quite a few variations over that long time period in case, caliber, dial, and bezel configuration. The Dodane comes in several versions of the case, and there are five or six different bezel configurations as well (the 60 second version below is quite scarce). Some of the Breuget and Dodane versions have dials aged to a fine chocolate/tropical color - would love to find one of those some time. Excellent write-ups on the Type 20/21s can be found here. http://www.classicwatch.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?t=43 http://montresmecaniques.forumactif.com/t9152-on-sort-les-type-20 (thanks @Ludi) I'm a big fan. Love the simplicity and true tool watch nature of these mil-spec watches. They've generally been knocked about a bit in service (and were not polished while in active use), so easy to wear with no worries. What's not to like?
It´s a cliff hanger by Al. And that´s not so like him, he´s usually quite straight-forward in his posts....
Sorry, I wasn't meaning to make this into a cliff hanger, but I posted that fairly late last night and have not been back here since. Am I the only one who sees the problems with this movement? Sorry I guess I always look with "watchmaker" eyes first, then "collector" eyes. I am working on a post about "what to look for" when viewing movement pictures on line, and this one would be a good example to use. When viewing a movement like this, what immediately struck me were the inconsistencies in the type of springs used. I see nicely machined springs that are pinned to the plates, then 3 fairly prominent wire springs, and those don't normally go together in one movement. Immediately after spotting that, the tell tale empty holes in the plate were noted, and that kind of seals the deal...even if you are not particularly familiar with the movement these things can stand out once your eye is used to looking for them. I've marked up the movement shot: The three red arrows (sorry one has turned partially green - photoshop quirk) point to flat wire springs that are inconsistent with the springs used in the rest of the movement. I would expect those to be machined springs, and the holes surrounding the area where each spring is mounted would seem to confirm that...here are 3 springs I just snapped a quick photo of from a movement we are all pretty familiar with - Omega Cal. 861: Note that each spring has pins on the underside, and these go in holes in the bridge to locate the spring, then a screw is used to hold the spring down. When I see a wire spring that emanates from a spot where there are locating holes in the plate, this raises alarm bells for sure. In the marked up shot of the Dodane's movement, I have added 2 green arrows where you can see both holes missing on the spring for the coupling yoke. So when I say missing, I meant the original parts were missing and have been replaced by some parts likely a watchmaker bent up at his bench to get the watch running again. It's not necessarily a nefarious repair, because likely when done this was the standard for just getting a functional object working again, so not a collector's item of any kind... Cheers, Al
The noted use of wires in the OP's movement is, in my experience, quite normal & common for this reference - perhaps even in the majority. I suspect that's just the way it was done when those parts needed replacing while in service. Another example...