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Speedmasters in Antiquorum Geneva March 2020

  1. Spacefruit

    Spacefruit Prolific Speedmaster Hoarder Mar 9, 2020

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    They have a good selection of vintage an modern.
    Looking forward to hearing what people have to say about them.
    The catalog here
    My review here

    And some of the watches on sale, that I reviewed:


    Lot 146 145.022-69 4000 6000 2842 6158 1171/677


    146.JPG


    Lot 147 145.022-69 4000 6000 31629907 1479/812




    147.JPG

    Lot 150 145.012-67 3000 5000 25006151 Omega no marks / extra bezel



    150.JPG

    Lot 151 145.012-67 8000 12000 25007178 Telemeter Leather




    151.JPG

    Lot 289 145.012-67 22000 32000 26076838 UM 1039/516



    289.JPG

    Lot 290 2998-1 17301445 45000 90000 Brown Dial 7077/6





    290.JPG

    Lot 292 2915-2 15997985 80000 120000 7077 / 532


    292.JPG

    What do you all think?
    For me, I want to buy one, I think one is massively, mistakenly over priced, and one is a boomerang.

    The catalog here
    My review here
     
    Edited Mar 9, 2020
    MCC, M'Bob, bdp and 8 others like this.
  2. Foo2rama

    Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Mar 9, 2020

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    Lot 150.... I would avoid, as to make that one right.... the catalog is missing something important in its notes on that one...

    Lot 292 looks amazing!

    Lot 150 and 151 could be a great deal depends on bidders. But they have them priced weird, one is way to high the other way to low...

    Lot 289 is the correct range, but that hand looks short...


    Ones you skipped

    I am surprised you skipped 291, those do not come up for sale ever, and its a pretty great looking piece. Looks like they have no idea how to price it either with a 50k-100k price range lol.

    Lot 62 could be a great pick up and missed by people bidding in that auction...

    Lot 65 is an odd one... Mission patch watches come up rarely, but alot of Italian collectors seem to have them on Facebook. I have not seen a Skylab one before, not a bad piece.

    Lot 68 is smoking crack, as you can get Tokyo Reds for MSRP still if you know where to look. Lot 69 and 70 is even worse as there is no way the green one is more expensive then the red one lol, and the gold accent one is not 2x as much!!!!!

    lot 74... decent japan racing... might be worth registering for an attempt at it esp if you want a cheap broad arrow from lot 62
     
    sdre, frederico and repoman like this.
  3. SpeedTar

    SpeedTar Mar 9, 2020

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    It's very strange that the 2998 brown was pictured without crystal. May be in order to highlight the dial.

    For the Ultraman, the short fitted orange hands would be a deal breaker to me as it's the most significant difference with a normal 145.012. I am wondering if by requesting an extract with a correct 145.012 serial range you for the mention "fitted with orange sweep second hand" if you added a seamaster 321 orange hand...
     
  4. cvalue13

    cvalue13 Mar 9, 2020

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    wristpirate likes this.
  5. watchyouwant

    watchyouwant ΩF Clairvoyant Mar 9, 2020

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    2915 will come back due to the replica bezel not disclosed. Kind regards. Achim
     
    Baz9614, KingCrouchy and cvalue13 like this.
  6. MTROIS

    MTROIS Mar 9, 2020

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    Guys, you really believe that the chrono hand and sub dial hands at 6 and 9 o’clock are original on lot 290? Seem too white (and new) to be true. No?
     
  7. repoman

    repoman Mar 9, 2020

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    Love this lot, estimated price range is mental.
     
    Foo2rama likes this.
  8. momosono

    momosono Mar 10, 2020

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    Their mixing up chronograph and chronometer (lot 101, I know its not an Omega but I looked at it all the same) increases - for me - my dislike of them.
     
  9. Spacefruit

    Spacefruit Prolific Speedmaster Hoarder Mar 10, 2020

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    I think the 2915 might sell and stay - why? Because they sold it twice already since 2010 and probably note it in the auction notes. Also a real bezel on a 2915 for under 100k ? Very unlikely at the moment.

    the brown 2998 has a fabulous color but let down by two lots of subdial damage.

    Funnily enough I thought 150 was interesting at the low estimate, did I make a schoolboy error and miss something? Does it have an obvious flaw? At under $4,000 all in I thought it might be good. I wouldn’t bid without looking at it mind you.

    I agree that the Japan Racing and the Gold Panda are interesting I don’t review them as I leave that to those who know more, I stick to pre -78.

    on a general note re AQ. These are auctioneers not dealers or retailers. Their job is to present us with a selection to view assess and buy. While I expect a certain amount of due diligence and even some post sale responsibility, I do not expect them, or any auction house, to forensically investigate every lot.

    that means we as buyers have a greater responsibility to verify potential purchases and take more responsibility for ourselves. in return we get to see a huge number and variety of watches in one place and one time.

    If we want retail service then we must go to retailers who know what they are talking about like The Davidoffs and buy from them.

    I like the fact that auctions present this huge choice and that I have to be quite careful with what i choose to buy from them. The down side is that the auctioneers allow a lot of dodgy things through, and I enjoy the challenge of hunting through it all.
     
  10. M'Bob

    M'Bob Mar 10, 2020

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    I second that. I genuinely look forward to William's Speedmaster auction run-down, both here and on his website. And I'm certain many others do too. The work you put in is obvious, and appreciated. Thanks William.
     
    marco, Om3ga321, Dash1 and 6 others like this.
  11. Foo2rama

    Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Mar 10, 2020

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    my bad I got it backwards and thought 150 was the one above and then would have been missing the AML.

    I got it correct lower down where I talked about 150/151. I agree those could both go for a steal esp with 150’s estimate being to low.

    My bad.
     
  12. Spacefruit

    Spacefruit Prolific Speedmaster Hoarder Mar 10, 2020

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    :)

    Probably my bad...didn't lay it out clearly.
     
    Foo2rama likes this.
  13. AdamS

    AdamS Mar 23, 2020

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  14. abrod520

    abrod520 Mar 23, 2020

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    M'Bob likes this.
  15. vinylcall

    vinylcall Mar 23, 2020

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    Someone did well with 147 (straight writing). That was a good deal.

    74 (Japan Racing) seems a fair deal too, considering the condition and package. Despite the additional VAT

    And 146 wasn’t too bad either. Although the condition didn’t appeal to me.

    290 (2998-1) Why did that go for the low estimate? Is that one of the steals? I‘ll leave that to the experts....

    So, did anyone here win one of the lots?
     
  16. killer67

    killer67 Mar 23, 2020

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    Lot 292 is a fake insert
     
  17. ndgal

    ndgal Mar 23, 2020

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    Look at the dial...
     
  18. repoman

    repoman Mar 24, 2020 2:41am

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    The Golden Panda (lot 291) did well, $52,500 CHF hammer. Those have always sold well, probably one of the most popular gold Speedies along with the first gold Apollo XI from 1970. Only 40 made, this was #01 which may have helped the price? Many other solid gold Speedies, even with solid gold bracelets struggle to get past $20k.
     
  19. Spacefruit

    Spacefruit Prolific Speedmaster Hoarder Mar 24, 2020 2:55am

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    Indeed it is, as suggested by the price and all pre sale reviews, a non original bezel.

    There is still a strong demand for 2915's at the right level, even with an incorrect bezel, but as I said at the right price - which I think it around $25,000 to $30,000. I am not talking about watches bought by knowledgeable collectors, who will still pay a lot of money for an attractive correct example, I am talking about first time buyers with balls, who buy a 2915 with some issues, such as corrosion, damaged dial, lacking a bezel. (No judgement - many of us bought our first 2915 deeply flawed, but it taught me a lot). This is the third time AQ has offered this exact watch since 2013. I say exact, each time it has a small change in specification.

    The brown 2998 was exactly the quality of watch that I had expected will be hard to sell, in that you need to make a lot of excuses for it, unless the first thing you say about it is that it is cheap. I wonder if there was more than one bidder for it.

    The dial is damaged, the bezel is faded - it has the look and feel from the photos of a prepared, or trade watch. The chrono hand is very clean (so replaced or re painted) , the subdial hands are slightly different colour. The bezel is something I would want to check closely - do you see any edge damage? At all? Combined with what may be bleaching, could this be a counterfeit bezel? Something to check or remove from the valuation.

    When all is said and done on this 2998 it is attractive, but damaged, and I would enjoy owning it but at a low price. I cannot help but wonder if this watch was bought by a naive buyer, or a first time brown purchaser. Ifeel the flaws on this watch will become more obvious in ownership, and may lead to regret on the price.

    The other speedmasters all sold, and this was quite an interesting thing to see - that there are still buyers. In fact the AQ results looked and felt to be on par with previous AQ auctions. They always did have a lot of low estimate sales and passed lots, and so I wonder what we can draw from this. I think they had a much better sale than I imagined they might have, given the situation.

    Watches of Knightsbridge are going ahead with their sale and frankly I like the watches and prices in it much more than AQ. Going by the success, (and it was a success make no mistake) of AQ I wonder how it will go for WOK.
     
    Edited Mar 24, 2020 6:49am
  20. vinylcall

    vinylcall Mar 24, 2020 6:36pm

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    Thank you for the extensive evaluation! This definitely helps to understand more about the bits that make a major difference in collectibility and thus value.