Speedmaster Pro 145012-67 Thoughts?

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n85ae

·Jan 29, 2022

Hi -

I posted this watch previously, but now have some internal pics. I'm likely going to sell it and curious
what the condition of the watch would be considered from the pics? Good, Very Good, Excellent? I'm
not a watch expert, but on the other hand want to be educated enough to not make a bad deal.

Watch works perfectly, has probably been to the Omega shop a few times since the band is newer
(I have the original), and it looks like the bezel, and hands may have been replaced at some point.

Thanks!
Jeff

View attachment 1360760 View attachment 1360761 View attachment 1360762 View attachment 1360763

Edited: Jan 29, 2022

 

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Dan S

·Jan 29, 2022

I'm not even sure those parts are authentic, or maybe for a different Omega. There is also lume loss on the dial. It's hard to judge based on those photos alone, but I would not say that the condition would reach anywhere close to good. Based on what I'm seeing so far, I'm at fair.

 

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perenowell

·Jan 29, 2022

Hi,

As someone said in the other thread, your watch has some service / wrong parts : Bezel and hands at least..
The dial has some lume missing.
Some pictures of the back and all sides of the watch should help to see the case condition.
do you have pics of the bracelet and end links too?

 

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n85ae

·Jan 29, 2022

Not sure what Lume Loss is, but I assume the greenish luminous tint on the hour markers and hands which is faded. The watch has been in the family since new, so I know it's not a Frankenstein watch, but it was worn daily for many years so likely was into the shop for service, and it would make sense that the bezel and hands could have been replaced.

Jeff

 

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n85ae

·Jan 29, 2022

Added some more images, wish there was a better way to edit these threads ...

Jeff

 

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Dan S

·Jan 29, 2022

The photos are not particularly good, but it appears that the lume is not just faded, but that it has flaked off in places, which would be a major condition issue. Unfortunately, it is a bit of a Frankenstein, since the hands are definitely not correct for this model. But that's just semantics. The watch has value and someone will want it, it's just not a collector piece. The good news is that if you have the original bracelet, it has value ... especially if it has the correct original end-links.

BTW, you can edit any of your posts or threads by choosing edit in the OPTIONS menu below the post.

 

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studeb

·Jan 29, 2022

N n85ae

Not sure what Lume Loss is, but I assume the greenish luminous tint on the hour markers and hands which is faded.

Jeff

Lime loss is the missing brown/orange stuff on the hour hashes. The underlying paint is white and should be fully covered.

 

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n85ae

·Jan 29, 2022

I'm positive the watch face is original, and that's probably just 1967 paint fading away. Not sure how a watch from that vintage could not have the condition, unless it was never worn. Actually if a 1967 watch looked better than the one I have, I'd be suspicious that it could not be original, since apparently nobody wore the thing

I know the full history of this watch, from the owner perspective. It was purchased new in 1968-69 at the US Army PX in Fort Knox Kentucky. The watch was a daily wear watch for a career Army Officer (my Uncle) , and might have had the bezel replaced, but not sure if the hands ever were. He replaced the bracelet himself some years back, and kept the old one. As I recall the bezel I think had a dent in it at one time, so likely it was replaced. It looks a lot better than with the dented one, but probably devalued by a couple thousand dollars because of it 😀

In any case, the watch I have is a watch that was worn regularly by one person for many years, and everything non-original has to be the result of the normal process of simply owning and wearing one of them. Seems like a lot of them would be exactly the same if they come from non-collectors.

Jeff

 

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ApolloXVII

·Jan 29, 2022

For me it's very hard to evaluate this watch..Maybe just put it on an auction on eBay and you will have the value..

 

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befobe

·Jan 30, 2022

N n85ae

normal process

The normal process is that a watchmaker replaces parts with original parts of the same model. So the watch got not-normal services...
I love this ref, and the B4 bezel on this lovely and historical speedy hurt my eyes...

Btw, what are the first movement figures? (Cannot read them on the pic)

 

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Aludic

·Jan 30, 2022·@SpeedyBirthYear

N n85ae

it looks like the bezel, and hands may have been replaced at some point.

Well spotted. The bezel is much newer and the hands are wrong. These are a different model, made for a Speedmaster Mark II.

As said above, this watch is far from fully original and should be valued accordingly. It might still be interesting. Much better - and more - pictures are needed to make any well-founded statements about it, beyond some obviously wrong parts.

Ultimately, what counts is whether you enjoy wearing it. 😉

 

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n85ae

·Jan 30, 2022

Thats' a bit obtuse.

No, the point is that a lot of these watches were worn as watches, not statusy jewelry and when things wore out they got taken in and fixed. That doesn't mean that it was owned by somebody obsessed with a DON vs. DNN bezel. they simply got a new bezel because it was bent. Now whether the watchmaker put the correct year bezel on it who knows?

In the "normal" world a lot of people own things, and when they need to be fixed, they take them to be "fixed". they are not sitting there agonizing over whether the part is the exactly correct part?

befobe

The normal process is that a watchmaker replaces parts with original parts of the same model. So the watch got not-normal services...
I love this ref, and the B4 bezel on this lovely and historical speedy hurt my eyes...

Btw, what are the first movement figures? (Cannot read them on the pic)

 

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hronists

·Jan 30, 2022

N n85ae

In the "normal" world a lot of people own things, and when they need to be fixed, they take them to be "fixed". they are not sitting there agonizing over whether the part is the exactly correct part?

Totally agree.

 

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befobe

·Jan 30, 2022

Of course a watch needs to be worn, and broken, and repaired, etc... Don't talk about the bezel. At least, the B4 bezel is for a moonwatch. And of course, during a modern service, the watchmaker does not supply a DON... I talk about the hands of course. The watch is surely valuable, I just say that it met during its tough life a watchmaker not very respectful for a speedy... That's all. And anyway, it is now easy to find correct ones.

Edited: Jan 30, 2022

 

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mountainunder

·Jan 30, 2022

In general, collectors of vintage watches place great importance on the originality of the timepiece. The price of the watch will also be higher if all the original parts are still intact and the watch is in good condition.

 

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Badwolf

·Jan 30, 2022

Hi Jeff. I’d suggest taking some photos outside in natural light. That would help show the overall condition of the watch.

 

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Jantar

·Jan 30, 2022

Aludic

Well spotted. The bezel is much newer and the hands are wrong. These are a different model, made for a Speedmaster Mark II.

As said above, this watch is far from fully original and should be valued accordingly. It might still be interesting. Much better - and more - pictures are needed to make any well-founded statements about it, beyond some obviously wrong parts.

Ultimately, what counts is whether you enjoy wearing it. 😉

I said the same thing in the other thread the OP started about this same watch. Different thread, same answers. This watch is not really a collector piece in its current condition, but it does have value. Just not as much as the OP would probably have hoped.

You can discuss the finer points of what is acceptable during a service but it doesn’t change the fact some of the parts on this particular watch are incorrect and will be expensive to source and make right. That, coupled with the dial condition equal a watch that will probably sell in the fair price range.

There are hundreds of pictures on this forum alone of original speedmaster dials in better condition.

Still a neat watch with a good story.

Edited: Jan 30, 2022

 

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Davidt

·Jan 30, 2022

The OPs correct that most of these watches were worn as intended and as a result have wear, service parts, lume loss etc. This is entirely normal and does indeed add to the story, history and often ‘interest’ in a watch.

However, it does also reduce the originality, condition and desirability to a collector. There are obviously many more Speedmasters in ‘running’ condition than ‘good’, more ‘good’ than ‘very good’ and more ‘very good’ than ‘collector’ as clearly it’s a pyramid and the fact that a ‘collector’ example must have seen little/no wear is precisely why they’re highly valued and hard to come by.

The OP watch appears to have original case, caseback, dial and movement, with service bezel, hands, bracelet and likely crown/pushers. There’s nothing wrong with this, it’s an honest, one owner watch, but like the vast majority of these watches it will fall into the ‘running’ category (or at the very most ‘good’) minus the value of period correct hands and bezel in comparable condition.

 

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Dan S

·Jan 30, 2022

N n85ae

I'm positive the watch face is original, and that's probably just 1967 paint fading away. Not sure how a watch from that vintage could not have the condition, unless it was never worn. Actually if a 1967 watch looked better than the one I have, I'd be suspicious that it could not be original, since apparently nobody wore the thing.

I guess you just don't like what the experts are telling you since it's not what you wanted to hear, but the lume is not fading, it is flaking off, and the underlying white painted plots are showing in places. Various types of damage are common, but damage like this is never desirable to collectors, who seek out and prize the less common vintage watches that remain in good condition. Dozens (maybe hundreds) of people on this forum own Speedmasters from the 60s that are in much better condition than yours, and many that are totally pristine.

Watches in good condition are not as easy to find as damaged and frankenized watches, but that's what we look for, and pay good money for. Since millions of these watches were made originally, there are still quite a few examples around that are in good condition.

Your watch has been used and enjoyed, and probably had some moisture intrusion at some point, damaging the dial and necessitating the replacement of the hands. There's nothing wrong with that, and maybe it looks OK to you, but from a collector's standpoint, the condition is not good, and it affects the value. If you don't believe us, try to sell it. If your watch were desirable, your mailbox would be full of PMs with big offers.

Edited: Jan 30, 2022

 

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n85ae

·Jan 30, 2022

Wasn't really my intent to start multiple threads on his same watch 😀 I was just trying to get a starting point that if I were to try to sell the watch where to begin. Seems it's more complicated than I realized, and I do appreciate all the comments on the watch.

I personally never wear the watch, since I am a Timex Digital watch wearer. Maybe I'll just keep it for my kids for occasional family history and pull it out of the lock box.

My Uncle would have bought every watch in the PX had he known they would be worth this much now, and never opened them. They were actually nothing more than a cool watch, that everybody wanted, and basically like owning a Corvette. I guess the unique thing about this watch is it probably flew Combat Missions in Vietnam. Original owner was the Executive Officer of Charlie Troop 1st Squadron, Ninth Cavalry, First Cavalry Division, and here he is (probably wearing the watch) in Vietnam (Far right in the first photo). I have also seen him wearing the watch while cutting wood with a chainsaw at his house in Colorado, or working on his tractor (while wearing the watch).