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Speedmaster Mk2 - The Racing Dial - Advice please

  1. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    These have been on my long term "want" list... but they either tend to take such a premium over the black dial that I balk when it comes to purchase time, or they're rough as dogs.

    I'm negotiating with the seller of one at the moment... just wondered if anyone has a guide to what these watches are worth.

    Is the Racing dial worth the premium, given that I could buy a black faced MK2 and have a new service dial fitted for less?

    Is the racing dial a different reference?

    Help, as always appreciated chaps.
     
  2. ConElPueblo

    ConElPueblo Jan 8, 2016

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    Following this with interest...
     
  3. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    The watch in question.
    $_57-5.JPG $_57-6.JPG $_57-7.JPG
     
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  4. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    It's the same reference for the black dial and the racing dial - 145.014.

    This one has clear evidence of having had a case polish, probably to tart it up for sale. The brushed finish on the sides of the case has been mostly smoothed out, as has the radial finish on the front of the case. The smooth bevel edge along the side of the case looks slightly narrower than it would have come from the factory, so all together this indicates that the finish has been polished out and not just worn down through use.

    The case is also much newer looking than the dial and hands, which are a bit sun bleached. So the polish looks recent. You need to see a good pic of the movement, especially as there are indications that the watch is more worn than the shiny case initially suggests. It may just be an honest watch that's had a dealer shine put on it, but you should check.

    Given all that I wouldn't be paying top prices for it as it isn't pristine. Somewhere in the £1400-£1500 range might be right for this, assuming the movement is ok. I'm not totally on top of current prices, although £1500-£1750 seems to be the current range for very good examples (not many of those about though). The bracelet looks original and that counts for something too.

    Hope this helps.
     
  5. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    The seller says he has owned it for 12 years, and 8 years ago it went to Austin Kaye for a service... so probably STS?

    It looks like an old case refinish job to me... possibly from that service, given how shiny it looks.

    Between the lack of movement pictures, the difference between the dial/hands and the finish, and the filthy state of it (wrist grease, and whatever that green gunk is in the pushers) - I'm inclined towards walking away.

    We're at a little over £1000 - but I'm not sure if it's worth paying the racing dial premium for this watch.

    My gut says walk... but my gut has shit for brains.

    Hmmm.
     
  6. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    In that case, I saw this one on eBay a few days ago with a start price of about £750.

    As soon as I saw the words Austin Kaye I moved on. I'll never buy anything that has been through them. They don't use STS and they typically polish the shit out of everything they sell. This one seems to have got away fairly lightly, but it undermines my confidence in their mechanical servicing - which is another reason I steer clear of them.
     
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  7. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    Just checked, it's definitely on eBay at £750 starting bid, £1250 BIN.

    There are no bids on it, probably because the eBay pics are brightly lit and show much better just how much polishing has been done. It looks like a shiny ice cube - run away.

    Do an eBay search on "Omega Speedmaster Mk II. Circa 1970" to find it.
     
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  8. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    It is the one up on eBay, I offered £850 cash, he wanted £1100.

    I'm walking as we speak.

    On the AK thing, I was talking to Simon at STS a couple of weeks back, and they do a reasonable amount of work for AK... the rest now goes to Omega... probably to justify the prices.
     
  9. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    It's good to hear AK use STS a bit. But I've still never seen them sell anything that hasn't been badly over polished - maybe that'll be less the case in future ?

    By the way, if you're based in London and want to have a proper look at some MkII's I've got a couple of nice ones that wouldn't mind seeing the light of day for a change :)
     
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  10. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    Tell me more! :)

    London based (Moorgate/London wall for work).
     
    Edited Jan 8, 2016
  11. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    I have two out of the usual three models - a racing dial and the gold plated one. The black dial version doesn't quite do it for me!

    The city is easily accessible for me, especially near Thameslink stations. DM me if you want to have a squint at them.
     
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  12. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    Very cool.

    I keep thinking about setting up an Omega enthusiasts meet in London (I'm an event marketer by trade)... Wondering if there's enough of us local for beers?

    Might go start a fresh thread on that...
     
  13. SpikiSpikester

    SpikiSpikester @ ΩF Staff Member Jan 8, 2016

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    We have quite a few members who are in or around London. It could work...dates are always a practical difficulty though.
     
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  14. watchknut

    watchknut New watch + Instagram + wife = dumbass Jan 8, 2016

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    I passed on a nice example on ebay for $1,400 US about a month ago...did anyone here get it? I wasn't, and am not in the market for one, but am going to be on the lookout, as they are cool as hell.

    If your gut is shit...give it some Pepto, might help:thumbsup:
     
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  15. Maganator

    Maganator Jan 8, 2016

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    Here's mine. I've got the original bracelet but prefer it on the strap

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. Tom Dick

    Tom Dick and Harry Jan 8, 2016

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    As a rough price guide:

    OK and average non serviced example with good original tritium radial dial and hands: £1000 - £1200

    OK and average non serviced example converted to racing with luminova dial and hands: £800 - £950

    Nice clean original example with original dial and non official service: £1100 - £1350

    Nice clean original example with original dial and hands and official service: £1350 - £1500ish

    Immaculate and fully restored example with original dial and hands and box and papers: £1500 - £1750ish

    Immaculate and fully restored example with replacement luminova dial and hands, box and papers: £1350 - £1450ish

    All of the above is my personal opinion based on what I have seen pieces sell for, racing dials do attract a premium but get an original tritium one and remember that luminova dials are still available from Omega for about £200 so beware of an original black dial which has just been vagazzaled with a new racing dial.

    If you want a perfect 'STS treatment' original racing dial variation with box and papers then I may be able to help so drop me a PM
     
    Edited Jan 8, 2016
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  17. tyrantlizardrex

    tyrantlizardrex C is NOT for "Lizard". Jan 8, 2016

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    Thanks Tom, that's incredibly useful.

    I may have bought something else completely this evening... so the MK2 might have to wait. ;)
     
  18. Tom Dick

    Tom Dick and Harry Jan 8, 2016

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    My pleasure

    That is what the community is all about, I would recommend a MKII down the line, that are hugely under appreciated watches at the moment and as the Speedy lunacy continues to take hold and the 1950's to 1970's traditional design speedsters continue to become utterly unaffordable for most people and prices carry one skyrocketing the MKII will be a fund investment over the coming 1-3 years.

    My advice when you do get round to buying is buy a great example of a MKII racing with original tritium dial, you can't go wrong
     
  19. seann

    seann Jan 8, 2016

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    @SpikiSpikester I really like your profile pic. Saw him a couple years back.
     
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  20. grizzlycanuck

    grizzlycanuck Jan 8, 2016

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    Thank you for your info, that's great! I'd love to see some pics of the different dials etc available that you described. I get box and papers, but the substituted dials etc would be great for me to learn. Thanks [emoji120].

    Here's mine which is a one owner and I believe original dial and hands. Case I believe was polished a bit from use and the sleeve, but I'm not totally sure. I'm always always open to opinions. Cheers

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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