Hi Guys,

How is it possible to tell the difference between a Speedmaster 321 movement vs. Seamaster 321 movement without an extract?

As I understand it there are cases of Seamaster 321 movements fitted in to 2998 Speedmasters as they are cheaper and fall in the same serial range. And it is also hard to verify with an extract as they might not be able to give one out.

I have searched trying to find information, but cannot seem to find an answer to this.

 

Well, the references of the two movements you are comparing ought to tell you what you need to know. You know, the references "321" and "321" having identical names and all

 

The more 321s become and are worth, the more deception at hand

 

As long as OMEGA isn't able to provide reliable information concerning some of their late 50s and early 60s watches, it's almost impossible to tell if a movement belongs to a Speedmaster or a Seamaster Chrono.

You can ask for an extract, but all they can tell you is that Lemania did the job for them those days and they don't know. This is at least what I have experienced.

This finally made me think: Well, if even OMEGA don't know, who cares then?

 

Only difference between the 2 is which one was randomly picked up by a watch maker when watch was being made. Funny how complete luck of draw makes such a huge difference to some folks. Same with a lot of other movements. Take 552 that was used for SM300, but on a lot of other models as well. Some folks will pay 3-4x more for ones that were in SM300, even thought it is identical movement.

 

I suppose the up side of this is that (for those who are able to obtain an extract on a 321 serial number) it adds a bit of value to an 'Extract of the Archives' certificate well in excess of 120 Swiss Francs.

 

They are the same movement, no difference. The only difference that watches have is the length of the start/stop and reset lever buttons.

 

Not sure what you mean by the start/stop and reset lever “buttons” but there are parts that are movement parts that vary in length and sometimes in design based on the case type used. So yes technically the movements can be different.

 

Well, my watchmaker who’s worked on both ‘masters’ told me that - no differences.

 

“Masters”?

 

I believe he's suggesting his watch maker has worked on both his watches. One speedmaster one seamaster. Both "masters". I think. Anyhow...

have fun
kfw

 

Okay...fact still remains the the movements vary based on the case style. I’ve worked on both “masters” as well obviously...

 

Thanks! Can always count on you for in-depth insight. Anything specific that non-watchmakers might be able to spot (i.e. if you're looking at a 2998 picture and you ABC is only N long and doesn't reach to part X, then you know it was a Seamaster movement)? Or are these the kind of tells that can only be unearthed upon the watchmaker's bench? Thanks!

 

Unfortunately these won’t likely be readily discernible without some disassembly...

 

Makes sense. Thanks @Archer !

 

Can you be more specific, what are those parts that differ?

I'm also interested in the topic because I'm looking for a nice 321 for myself.

My watchmaker is [email protected] and he has worked on many-many seamasters and speedmasters ('masters'). His words are "The same movement with the same parts, apart from the length of the start/stop and reset lever buttons".
So did he mean the length of the buttons or a lever?

 

They are the same, except for the parts that are different.