Hi all,

I am new to the forum and to watch collecting in general, and though I do own a current model Omega Speedmaster I am a newbie when it comes to 60's vintage Omegas. I am currently looking at purchasing my first Constellation, and have been trawling the online auction sites (I know, gasp). I have read a number of the articles on Constellations over at http://omega-constellation-collectors.blogspot.com.au/ and I think I have just enough information and knowledge now to pose a considerable danger to my wallet . I am currently looking at the following auction over on ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-OME...istwatches&hash=item1c2758234b#ht_1296wt_1397Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

I love the pie-pan cross-hair dial configuration, and the hidden crown looks slick. Based on my scare knowledge so far, here are my thoughts:

What I like:
- Case number is 168.004. Case / crown looks to me to be correct for this case number (i.e. the lugs and hidden crown seem to be configured correctly for this case number, I think).
- Caliber is 561. This is correct for this case number according to http://www.omegawatches.com/spirit/history/vintage-omegas/vintage-watches-database
- The remainder of the markings on the mechanism look to be correct.
- The pie pan dial looks to have suffered some water damage (?). Whilst this damage seems limited, it suggests the watch has its original dial and hasn't been refinished.
- The watch seems to pass the "MOY" test, and I think it has the correct serif fonts.
- The hands and markers seem to be the correct configuration and size. Though the serial number dates this watch to 1964, there are no "T" markings on either side of the "Swiss Made" marking, which I believe is correct for this dial / hand combination.
- The date window looks to have the correct bevelled edge configuration.

What I am not sure on:
- The edges of the case look a little soft - my reading is that the corners should be sharp, but I am not sure on this in regards to this case number.
- The stars on the rear of the case look a little soft. Could this be a fake insert, a fake case back (therefore throwing the correctness of the entire watch into question), or is this a common wear pattern for this watch?
- Whilst the dial looks to not have been refinished, as noted above there looks to be some moisture damage - does this mean there is more under the surface lurking away? Can this be cleaned up?
- There are some marks on the working components / mechanism - are these normal and due to normal wear and tear, or possible signs of corrosion (given that it looks like moisture got into the watch at some point)
- The strap - looks like a very cheap copy (seller says it's new so no biggie here) - not sure what type of strap the watch would have originally had?

So overall I am leaning towards this being a good one, but being very much a newbie I want to check before I decide whether I want to make an offer on this watch. Any thoughts / input to assist?

Assuming that the watch is indeed as per factory spec, is this a reasonable price to ask? I see Connies ranging in price, often getting up to and around this value for similar models / configurations. I love the pie-pan cross-hair dial config and am happy to sit and wait until a nice one comes along, but I am on a limited budget and don't want to have to break the bank (and yes I am factoring in $300 or so for a service into my price considerations).

Any thoughts / inputs would be much appreciated!

Thanks folks,

BC

 

Thanks for the comments dsio, much appreciated. Looks like the seller has dropped the price down a little, so I am contemplating throwing in a lower offer to see if it gets a bite, if not, no harm done.

That Seamaster sure is nice, but just slightly above my budget unfortunately

I also very much like the look of the black dialled Constellations, but note that these seem to be a bit rarer, with the majority of those on the online auctions have re-finished dials. Here is one that I think has an original dial?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Ome...stwatches&hash=item3a75ed23e8#ht_15997wt_1003Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

Again, case (14381) / caliber (551) numbers seem to match (17 million serial number suggests 1960 manufacture), and the details for this date of Connie look ok to my inexperienced eye... The face looks like it has a patina of age that I think would be difficult to replicate? I note though that the hands look like they may be ever so slightly too large, and the hour markers seem a bit bright? Or is this just my inexperienced eye again? I also am slightly cautious of the seller being in Bangkok but he seems to have good feedback and a return policy (which I have flicked him some questions on). I am thinking about putting in a lower offer but again would appreciate the expert's advice here before I decide to jump in

Thanks again,

BC

 

Not only original, but uncommon too. It's called a railroad dial and did come in the 14.381 powered by a 551. We had a thread about on one here: http://omegaforums.net/threads/uncles-unique-constellation.738/.

I think both those B.I.N. prices are a tad high given the condition. More so the hidden crown by a few hundred.

 

Steve is right - closer inspection of the dial makes me believe the minute track has been retouched or tampered with somehow. The rest of the lettering seems okay though but more opinions are necessary.

 

Right Mike & Steve?

 

Me too. I've grabbed one or two back in the day, but I seem to do better in person than on fleabay.

Christoph from TZ has quite the resumé of great B.I.N. snags.

 

He's firmly entrenched at TZ. Good guy, and a regular on their vintage forum. I don't know his email address or I'd have invited him.

 

Thanks for the advice guys, very much appreciated from this newbie. I will keep an eye out for some better examples.My budget at the moment allows me to spend up to around $1500 for a good example (but I would like it to be a good one). I don't mind the gold-capped so much, as these seem to be still within my price range - I see the 14k and 18k models going for well into the $2000+ range on ebay (though these appear expensive, I suspect that they are likely better value for money?). Where else do you guys look to find your watches....?

Oh, dsio - just noticed that you live in Brisbane - same here

Thanks again folks!

BC

 

Ditto ULF re Steve's idiosyncratic view of gold cap

Gold cap (think rolled gold) in original finish and not polished badly is a sight to see. More than 200 and up to 250 microns microns of gold is fused to case and lugs (around ten times that of gold plate) and so if you like a gold watch as a more dressy piece, it's worth trawling for one that has it's original radial brushed finish and polished facet on the case sides and lugs.

Bezels in most gold capped cases are 14k solid. I would expect a 14k gold capped C-shape to last a 100 years of moderate wear without getting to base metal.

For 1500, you should get SS or gold cap in mintish condition with box and papers and with brickwork bracelet. Now that would be a sight to see.

Cheers

Desmond

 

Thanks Desmond - I'd be happy just to find a nice original good condition SS or Gold Cap pie pan cross-hair dial around that price point to start with... Most of the watches I am seeing on ebay have some kind of problem that I can find with them, or seem to be overpriced. You guys are making me too picky!

Cheers,

BC

 

Hi guys - I am trying to determine if this is a redial and am keen to learn - the first thing that concerns me is the condition - I note allot of black dials that are original have degraded due to solar and moisture exposure, but that surely is not a definitive criteria. The font and positioning seems ok to me (I think), and it doesn't appear to have been subsequently retouched (subsequent to the last coat of paint, that is), though what I am not sure on is the location of the "Swiss Made" (unless this is an early 300 series caliber?) and the dots at the hour markers (shouldn't these be small rectangles?)



...or maybe this one...?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Omega-Const...717591505?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item1e6f6027d1Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network
Not sure about this second watch as the date window doesn't seem to have the correct bevelled edges, and the last "n" in "constellation" doesn't look right?

Only asking as I do like these black dials

Thanks,

BC