There have been quite a few mentions of shill bidding of late in various threads. While the practice is deplorable, let's face it, it's a fact of life and one we have to deal with if buying the 'bay or other similar venues.

Let's say there's a great watch, one you simply MUST have for your collection and one that rarely turns up on the market. You decide to go for it, and set your top price $3,500. Your price is above market, but you simply must have it, can't remember the last time you saw one for sale (except at the dealer who wants 5x market), and so you vow to throw in the extra $$ to ensure you get it.

You don't bid immediately (you sniper you!), holding back for the final moments of the auction. In the meantime, you watch the bids develop, and it becomes clear (at least in your opinion) that there is a "shill" in the bidding, driving up the price. One by one, the other bidders falter, leaving the suspected "shill" in the top spot at $2950 with only minutes to go in the auction. The "shill" is clearly going to push the price further, has maybe already put in a higher auto-bid. Without the shill, the bidding may have finished well below your max.

You want the watch, you were ready to pay up to $3500.

What do you do? Do you drop out and wait for another example to show up in a year or two or three? Put in your high bid & hope for the best? How will you feel if you bid and win - maybe like you paid too much, even it ends below your top price?

 

It depends on how badly you want the watch.

Recently, I offered a seller $750 for a watch. The seller claims they didn't know how to end the auction early so it went to the end. I had a max bid of $600 in and got distracted at work so I "lost" out. A couple weeks later the "winner" failed to pay according to the seller (yeah, right - the seller thought they knew how far to push and it backfired) and I got a message from the seller that it was going to be relisted a few dollars higher than I had offered. Principles say to tell them to go themselves, but I really wanted it so I bought it. That particular watch hardly ever shows up with a nice original dial. I know, I know….. I basically rewarded someone for shilling, but that's life. If they're that desperate for a hundred-ish dollars than let them push their luck. Last time I'll buy from them.

(unless they have something I really want again )

 

Are you (we? anybody?) able to get the shill bidder's real login name?

 

a few options: as soon as you suspect shilling,place a bid above the going bid and above the last real bidders. if the shill drops out, you might be the high bidder, if the others stop bidding due to frustration. if you want to make life hard for the seller, withdraw your bid 1 day before the end and state: could not contact the seller. that will caution the other bidders.report shill bidding to ebay is maybe a waste of time. they get their fees from high prices.... . in the end you have to decide, which way to go. contact the seller for an out of ebay sale; is cheaper for him anyway.... kind regards. achim

 

You have to realize that there is no Consumer Protection Agency in most countries. This kind of crap, along with other shenanigans, is considered good business in a few places.

 

On a related topic, I've seen a few occasions where I had put in a high bid (possibly via a snipe) and it so happened that I won the auction at that exact price...which got me wondering if there was not some shill bidding tactic to drive up the price right up to the limit...can't see how but it had me puzzled.

 

unsniping apps ?

 

Shill is not totally forbidden, and believe it or not, in some European countries is still a practice and permitted by not having any laws against.
There are antique / art auction houses practicing shill and this is one of the reasons many collectors do not participate.
In an auction, it's hard to control emotions and it's easy to forget about shilling.
What i do instead, with the risk of losing the piece, is to wait till auction ends and make an offer within or under the estimated value. Auction houses accept such offers after end of auction (if item not sold).
I guess, what you could do here, if your top is above market, is to PM seller and make the offer as soon as you see the piece. I guess you'd spare at least the stress of waiting.

 

When you make an offer "off ebay" the seller (who might be ignorant about the real value) receives valuable information, some kind of estimation "for free" - then he can refuse your offer and shill his item as you have disclosed your personal limit by your offer...
I have experienced this several times.

I never make an offer like: "I give you xxx$" - I always ask the seller to fix the price and then accept (if the price is reasonable) or refuse.

And I stay away from auctions with obvious shill bidding... I do not "support" this behavior.

There will be another watch to go for soon (mostly before I have recovered from my latest wallet exhausting purchase)

 

Hear...hear
ps: I think I've been a victim in one or two shill bidding myself......

 

I've tried made an offer twice before the auction ended, asking for "the price you'd want to end the auction". Was given a price way above market & what I was willing to pay. I can understand it really, an informed seller isn't likely to end an auction early without a significant premium.

Once I mentally set my max price, I'll likely stay in an auction, shill or no. I'm in control of what I pay at the end of the day. It is annoying though. I've lost at least one close one where I believe a shill was involved, and pushed the price just slightly above my max, which was already somewhat above current market. The shill won it - item relisted a few weeks later with only a "buy it now" price well above market.

Interesting to hear how others deal (or don't) with the issue.

 

I very rarely buy a watch at auction, but almost always from "Buy it Now" listings where you can make offers. However, I always sell my watches in an auction listing.

 

Have learnt to live with shills and they don't bother me so much now. I only put in a bid that I will pay. Maybe that's why I seldom win in auctions now, only in BINs. There's always someone who wants the watch more than me. Anyhow, so many nice watches being sold on the forums, so I fret not. Only worrying about my shrinking watch funds. Life's too short to worry about them shills.

 

Many have said this before, but I like to set my snipers (yes I use them a lot) at the level of "personal indifference". Basically I set the max bid in the sniper at a level where I will be (very) happy to win it. If I do not win, there are plenty more fish in the sea. I have some times been very surprised about what have landed this way, and to what prices..... And I do not get carried away in the last minute to make "silly offers". Then Shilling will be a nuisance, but I will at least not overpay.