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  1. dodo44 Jul 9, 2018

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    Hello,
    I have had a bad experience with a small auction house and I would like to have some input from the community on how best to proceed. I was eyeing at a pocket watch and was using Liveauctioneers live for bidding. I was bidding against "someone". The bidding went up rapidly and I decided to stop the bidding at some point. The other bidder placed another bid and won the auction. As the auction was about to close (fair warning), the other bid disappeared and I became the highest bidder. This strikes me as a potential shady practice to reveal the highest bid that one is willing to place. I think that it is a practice in some auction houses to bid against normal bidders, which amounts to a hidden reserve price. I guess that I am fine with that. The issue here is that they cancelled the highest bid (at this stage, I am not sure whether that bid came from them or a genuine live bidder). I have browsed online and two people report the exact same experience with that same auction house so I have strong suspicions that the auction house is manipulating the auction process. I have a few questions:

    What is the legality of that practice?
    What are my options with regard to payment (I am leaning heavily towards not paying, which would be the first time in many years of dealing with auction houses)?
    Should I file a complain with the Federal Trade Commission against the auction house?
    What is the legality of outing them here or on consumer platforms such as ripoffreport.com?

    Thanks and best regards,
    Dodo44
     
  2. michael22 Jul 9, 2018

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    Legality depends on where you live, so you should mention that much.

    Sounds dodgy, & I would not trust them ever again. But that is the world we live in, & you need to think about how you will deal with that in future.
     
  3. dodo44 Jul 9, 2018

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    michael22 likes this.
  4. chanbar Jul 9, 2018

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    I would dispute it by informing the auction house you did not win the bid as you were outbid and walked away and will not pay for something you didn’t win. It is the auction house’s move from there if they wish to pursue it. My guess is they won’t.
     
  5. TDBK Jul 9, 2018

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    You should read the agreement you entered into with Liveauctioneers or the auction house, but in my opinion, if that bidder backed out or was removed, all their bids should be cancelled, and you would win the auction with the lowest bid which beat a bona fide bidder.
     
  6. ulackfocus Jul 9, 2018

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    The Internet is the modern Wild West. Besides, shills have been employed at auctions before web bids were used. Now it's just easier to do just what you described.

    Where was the auction house located? If it's in the US (or any country that has consumer fraud protection) you should report them.
     
  7. dodo44 Jul 9, 2018

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    It is Connecticut. It looks like they have been in business for a while.
     
  8. gemstar Jul 9, 2018

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    I was checking out Liveauctions last year to bid on a few items like the loose diamond auctions and other stuff..The prices were crazy high! More than wholesale. I also read allot of negative reviews online that left me closing my account. No risk no reward is true but you don't jump into the Ocean when you are told there are Great white's waiting for you to enter.
     
  9. dodo44 Jul 9, 2018

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    I guess I am not the tastiest meal; they will not see the color of my money. Although I am in the US, I more often deal with auction houses in Europe, which are a lot more professional.
     
  10. larryganz The cable guy Jul 10, 2018

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    If the winning bid was removed, your winning bid should be the highest bid in which the other bidder was NOT involved in.

    In other words, lets say three bidders were trying to win, and you bidder #1 were being outbid by bidder #2 and #3 and then beating them over and over, and #2 won, but now bidder #2 has been removed, then you should win with the final bid that beat bidder #3 who is still in the auction.
     
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  11. dodo44 Aug 5, 2018

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    Some update. The auction house is Tim's Inc. Auction

    They did not reply to my voicemails or messages until a few days ago. They told me that they would file a complain for non-payment with Liveauctioneers. After threatening me, they asked me if I had been bidding live and they hung up on me when I told them that yes; I was in front of my computer bidding live. I guess that their scheme only works with people who leave absentee bids and do not pay attention to the live auction. My advice based on this experience is to always follow the auction live if you can so that you can see if someone is trying to scam you. Note that I have extensive experience bidding with auction houses, small and large (mostly in the US, France, UK, and Germany). Liveauctioneers has been completely unhelpful.

    The auction house seems to be a repeat offender (check those reports from 2013 and 2016):

    https://www.ripoffreport.com/report...-the-auctioneers-to-know-you-bid-cont-1070431

    https://www.ripoffreport.com/report...r-consigning-to-this-auctioneer-brist-1303730
     
    djmusicman likes this.
  12. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Aug 5, 2018

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    Nice scam. I’d call a detective in their city and explain how it works, they did it to you and there are other matching complaints.

    Only real recourse.
     
  13. w154 Aug 6, 2018

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    I’ve had it once via thesaleroom.com.

    I can’t remember the item or the auction house, but I bid live online and there was another bidder. It went something like me 375, them 400, pause... me win 375. thought it was dodgy but was happy to win.

    And once kind of in reverse. It was bid 175, then me 200, then 225, then me 250 (saying I was in the lead), then a blink and it went to sold at 175. they explained that the bids were registering with thesaleroom, but not a quick enough link to the auction house. Not sure if that makes sense ? If it does, then I t could explain our other situations and we were lucky another bidders bids didn’t register.