Paypal G&S question

[unxsr]

Not particularly watch related question but something good to know if I decide to sell watches in the future.

I sold an item (camera related gear) on a different site and the buyer asked if I did Paypal G&S. I don't sell much online so to gain his trust I accepted to send the item via Paypal G&S. I don't think anything will go wrong since I know the item I've sent is as described and he seemed like a good person, however, is there a way that a buyer could abuse the G&S system?

 

[Evitzee]

Did you do a G&S or F&F (Friends & Family) payment? You should be covered by G&S, not so much by F&F. Your question almost sounds like you did a F&F payment which doesn't offer you much protection if the sale blows up.

 

[unxsr]

Evitzee

Did you do a G&S or F&F (Friends & Family) payment? You should be covered by G&S, not so much by F&F. Your question almost sounds like you did a F&F payment which doesn't offer you much protection if the sale blows up.

I was the seller and I did G&S. First time selling an item more than $1000 so I'm a little concerned.

Edited: Jul 23, 2022

 

[KeithS]

In practice, there is not much difference between G&S and F&F. With G&S, the buyer can dispute a charge directly with PayPal (e.g. claim the seller never shipped the item) and get their money back. PayPal generally sides with the buyer. With F&F, PayPal offers no protection; however, the buyer can always dispute the charge with their credit card company and get their money back.

 

[unxsr]

KeithS

In practice, there is not much difference between G&S and F&F. With G&S, the buyer can dispute a charge directly with PayPal (e.g. claim the seller never shipped the item) and get their money back. PayPal generally sides with the buyer. With F&F, PayPal offers no protection; however, the buyer can always dispute the charge with their credit card company and get their money back.

Thanks for the reply. I've added the shipping info on Paypal too, so hopefully nothing crazy happens.
I guess my fear is that scammers claiming they never received the item when the item was delivered.

 

[TDBK]

To benefit from PayPal protections, you need to follow the guidelines in https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/security/seller-protection, including only shipping to eligible addresses and that PayPal indicates the transaction is safe by classifying it as eligible.

 

[Donn Chambers]

unxsr

Not particularly watch related question but something good to know if I decide to sell watches in the future.

I sold an item (camera related gear) on a different site and the buyer asked if I did Paypal G&S. I don't sell much online so to gain his trust I accepted to send the item via Paypal G&S. I don't think anything will go wrong since I know the item I've sent is as described and he seemed like a good person, however, is there a way that a buyer could abuse the G&S system?

interesting. I’ve never had a buyer ask for processing by G&S — they always want me to do it by F&F to avoid fees. I will only do F&F if it is someone I know (or a well-known member of a forum) — otherwise I insist of G&S for the added protection. And then, as recommended, I send an invoice AND only ship to their registered PayPal address.

 

[duc]

With G&S, if you upload a tracking number, pp automatically tracks it. When the shipping service updates the item as delivered, pp transfers the money to your account one day later. I just went through this last week, and like you I rarely use pp.

My previous recollection was the buyer would have to click the "Item Received" option on their end of pp to conclude the transaction and release the funds. After discussing it with pp, I was informed that only happens if G&S is used and the seller does not upload tracking information.

 

[unxsr]

Donn Chambers

interesting. I’ve never had a buyer ask for processing by G&S — they always want me to do it by F&F to avoid fees. I will only do F&F if it is someone I know (or a well-known member of a forum) — otherwise I insist of G&S for the added protection. And then, as recommended, I send an invoice AND only ship to their registered PayPal address.

Good to know, thank you. I didn't send an invoice but sent him my e-mail address and I have the invoice details on Paypal, so hope that is ok.
I also double checked just now and the address he asked me to ship matches the address on his Paypal.

 

[unxsr]

duc

With G&S, if you upload a tracking number, pp automatically tracks it. When the shipping service updates the item as delivered, pp transfers the money to your account one day later. I just went through this last week, and like you I rarely use pp.

My previous recollection was the buyer would have to click the "Item Received" option on their end of pp to conclude the transaction and release the funds. After discussing it with pp, I was informed that only happens if G&S is used and the seller does not upload tracking information.

Thanks for the info.Glad I updated the tracking info the day I shipped the item on Paypal.

 

[Scarecrow Boat]

In order for a buyer to try to scam you through PayPal, they have to file a dispute, which PayPal will alert you of and give 2 weeks to respond. However, not everyone out there is out to do shady things. I have sold a number of high value cameras and other items via PayPal G&S back when I participated Facebook specific groups and have never run into an issue. Try not to stress. You have done what you can do by uploading shipping to the PayPal order. If the buyer claims they did not receive the item despite it being delivered, PayPal will look into the tracking, see it was delivered, ask the buyer to verify it was left somewhere hidden/at neighbors house and if still not found, they will ask the buyer to file a police report and provide documentation. It’s not as simple as the buyer asking for their money back and PayPal handing it to them.

 

[unxsr]

Scarecrow Boat

In order for a buyer to try to scam you through PayPal, they have to file a dispute, which PayPal will alert you of and give 2 weeks to respond. However, not everyone out there is out to do shady things. I have sold a number of high value cameras and other items via PayPal G&S back when I participated Facebook specific groups and have never run into an issue. Try not to stress. You have done what you can do by uploading shipping to the PayPal order. If the buyer claims they did not receive the item despite it being delivered, PayPal will look into the tracking, see it was delivered, ask the buyer to verify it was left somewhere hidden/at neighbors house and if still not found, they will ask the buyer to file a police report and provide documentation. It’s not as simple as the buyer asking for their money back and PayPal handing it to them.

Really appreciate your response.

 

[FreelanceWriter]

KeithS

... however, the buyer can always dispute the charge with their credit card company and get their money back.

I don't think so, unless they fraudulently claim that the charge was unauthorized. Otherwise, I believe the CC will always defer to the PayPal TOS that you agree to, which include agreeing that PP will decide these claims. (I had this discussion in advance with AMEX when I was deciding what funding source/method to use when I purchased my Grail from a sketchy-seeming seller in Turkey with 0 previous transactions in 2012. It took a lot of annoying pulling teeth and objecting to non-answers and to answers to questions that I wasn't asking; but they eventually admitted that any transaction dispute would be decided by PayPal and that AMEX wouldn't protect me at all if PP ruled against me.) However, the easiest way for buyers to rip off sellers is to issue F&F payments (now called "trusted recipient") and select their bank account as the payment method instead of any CC. If they purposely do it without the necessary funds available in the account to cover the payment, (or if they purposely drain the funds right after the sale), the payment just never goes through and you might not even get a notice that the transaction failed for about a week; and unlike G&S payments, there's no automatic CC backup payment source for F&F payments. Sellers can easily get burned that way, because they don't realize that F&F payments are only "safer" from any dispute if there's actually enough money in the account to cover the sale. So, if you accept a F&F payment, never ship the item until you can confirm that the funds are actually in your bank account.

Edited: Jul 25, 2022

 

[KeithS]

FreelanceWriter

I don't think so, unless they fraudulently claim that the charge was unauthorized.

That is indeed how the scam works.