Originally about tariffs and watches ... now just political rambling

Locked
Posts
3,666
Likes
7,786
Stop following the Obama messaging of "when they go low, we go high". Republicans have stopped with the pretense and decorum years ago. As much as I hate to say it but if Democrats want to win, they need to be willing to get dirty.
Or at least, change tactics drastically. This has consistently been a huge part of my philosophical posting in this entire thread.


Republicans were composed of a whole bunch of sub parties and seemed divided. Now, they are unified behind MAGA.
 
Posts
3,666
Likes
7,786
This is how I've thought of the Dems the last few years. They just don't understand the game that's being played.


Yeah, this is something that has really stuck with me for at least the last two years or so. There's this response of well "that's not true, that's not fair, so I guess saying that is enough." Most of the major media outlets that are considered democratic-leaning are selling news by being shocked, baffled, and flabbergasted at the latest republican outrage. That's great I suppose, but the message is one of a shared sense. it's worth asking if a shared sense of outrage has value as a consistent message of policy. And sure, CNN is not the voice of the national democratic party, but it also has the value to point out that Fox News has become the de facto voice of the current Republican Party in many, many ways.
 
Posts
2,779
Likes
14,818
This is really strange. The Prime Minister of Canada will meet with President of the United States Donald Trump. I thought Canada hated Trump? I thought it was all chaos?
Really weird. All the blather from OF'ers I thought the PM would be visiting China or France, one of the "good" guys.
Instead the PM is heading to the White House the center of nest of vipers
. The PM is a brave soul. Doesn't he fear he will be carried off to a waiting plane and whisked off to El Salvador?
 
Posts
29,245
Likes
75,639
This is really strange. The Prime Minister of Canada will meet with President of the United States Donald Trump.
That is really weird...I thought we only had a governor?

All the blather from OF'ers I thought the PM would be visiting China or France, one of the "good" guys.
He's already met with the leaders of both France and the UK...

Instead the PM is heading to the White House the center of nest of vipers
Well, if our PM is there at least one adult will be in the room. 😉
 
Posts
2,408
Likes
6,951
This is really strange. The Prime Minister of Canada will meet with President of the United States Donald Trump. I thought Canada hated Trump? I thought it was all chaos?
Really weird. All the blather from OF'ers I thought the PM would be visiting China or France, one of the "good" guys.
Instead the PM is heading to the White House the center of nest of vipers
. The PM is a brave soul. Doesn't he fear he will be carried off to a waiting plane and whisked off to El Salvador?
A real king will come to Canada to visit the PM.
 
Posts
6,030
Likes
20,733
Thank you for raising this. Obama was one of the most talented politicians I've seen; he also oversaw extrajudicial drone killings on a scale that would've had people marching in the street had those orders been given by anyone else (imo). The Affordable Care Act was an amazing achievement; it also could and should have been much more muscular, given the political capital required to pass it. He took several years to repeal Don't Ask Don't Tell, didn't originally support gay marraige, etc. etc. etc.
The list is depressingly long. He was extremely militaristic, and facilitated a number of highly damaging, neoliberal-inspired "operations" on his watch. They included Libya (2011), and the U.S. sponsored coup in Ukraine in 2014, a huge catalyst for Russia's subsequent actions, which obviously resonate loudly today. He also chose policies in the Middle East that are directly related to much of the instability in the region today, and his record in Iraq and Afghanistan are also highly dubious.

Orwell himself wouldn't believe it if he were told that Obama had won a Nobel Peace Prize.

There were many terrible domestic policies as well. It was on his watch that the TBTF banks were bailed out after the 2008 crisis, creating tremendous moral hazard, and widening the wealth gap significantly. The ensuing economic policies then set the stage for where the U.S. is today.

Etc., etc., etc.

As a big Obama fan (I took my daughters to the rallies and my oldest got to shake his hand), I was disappointed by some of the same results (without agreeing completely with your analysis. For example, if he had stood up for Crimea, things might be different in Ukraine now, but we almost might have been in a war earlier.)

Regardless, there is simply no comparison between prior administrations and Trump. Imagine if Obama had issued his own bitcoin trading floor and written executive orders to have no oversight, or arrested a judge, or used the DOJ to investigate his opponents, etc, etc? Republicans would have rightfully gone nuts. What happened to states rights, less federal government? From where I sit, it looks like freedom is only for straight, white, evangelicals.

Why stop at Obama (although for some reason Obama pisses off Republicans alot)? Why not Reagan and Clinton? Keep going, there're many obvious failures.

It is intellectually dishonest to not acknowledge that Trump is acting unconstitutional (illegally) in a manner that this country has likely never seen, outside of a few extremes inacted during the civil war and WWII.

It's like his supporters are afraid to acknowledge any of Trump's failings. Any "what about.." are ludicrous.


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Akq0xeu-RHE&ved=2ahUKEwiqv4Kl84yNAxWbFTQIHZUhFsUQz40FegQIDxAJ&usg=AOvVaw0Z6cFp81YykJTS_TCZ3Q1m
Edited:
 
Posts
1,774
Likes
7,017
But from a MAGA point of view, just how many hurricanes have ever developed in the Gulf of America?

[Sorry Al, I seem to be being a prize cockeral in response to more of your posts than anyone else. Absolutely nothing personal.]
None yet, but lots in the Gulf of Mexico.........
 
Posts
3,861
Likes
6,577
I just want Trump to answer one question while on live TV. Name the 10 commandments.
 
Posts
29,245
Likes
75,639
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...S&cvid=57a042aed8df40048820843625b98970&ei=15


Canadian Army in Chaos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not sure I would call it chaos, but there's no doubt that many governments here over the years (both Liberal and Conservative) have neglected military spending. I saw that myself back in the 80's when I was serving. My hopes were elevated when the defense minister of the era, Perrin Beatty, issued a white paper on the future of the Canadian military that emphasized not relying too much on the US, and the PM of the day (Brian Mulroney - Conservative and Reagan's close buddy) initially supported it, but then backed away from pretty much all the spending. My hope is that this new government will ramp up that spending quickly.

I know you believe this is some kind of gotcha article, but adults can actually look at their own country with a critical eye, find fault with their governments, and not throw a tantrum.
 
Posts
3,572
Likes
24,123
I just want Trump to answer one question while on live TV. Name the 10 commandments.

While he's at it, you think he can name the provisions in the Bill of Rights or the process by which a bill becomes a law?
 
Posts
2,779
Likes
14,818
As a big Obama fan (I took my daughters to the rallies and my oldest got to shake his hand), I was disappointed by some of the same results (without agreeing completely with your analysis. For example, if he had stood up for Crimea, things might be different in Ukraine now, but we almost might have been in a war earlier.)

Regardless, there is simply no comparison between prior administrations and Trump. Imagine if Obama had issued his own bitcoin trading floor and written executive orders to have no oversight, or arrested a judge, or used the DOJ to investigate his opponents, etc, etc? Republicans would have rightfully gone nuts. What happened to states rights, less federal government? From where I sit, it looks like freedom is only for straight, white, evangelicals.

Why stop at Obama (although for some reason Obama pisses off Republicans alot)? Why not Reagan and Clinton? Keep going, there're many obvious failures.

It is intellectually dishonest to not acknowledge that Trump is acting unconstitutional (illegally) in a manner that this country has likely never seen, outside of a few extremes inacted during the civil war and WWII.

It's like his supporters are afraid to acknowledge any of Trump's failings. Any "what about.." are ludicrous.


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Akq0xeu-RHE&ved=2ahUKEwiqv4Kl84yNAxWbFTQIHZUhFsUQz40FegQIDxAJ&usg=AOvVaw0Z6cFp81YykJTS_TCZ3Q1m


Mr. Pdxleaf, approx. 7 million illegals crossed border 2020-2024. Tell us all how we go back and verify the identities and criminal pasts of the 7 million. Let say only 10% are criminals. 700,000 on American streets. Let us say 1%. 70,000 criminals on American streets. Your fine and dandy with this I assume. Biden process was fine, come on in, we don't care who you are.

More than once, President of the United States Donald J Trump has stated immigration is wonderful. Just follow the legal process that all other countries in the world enforce.
 
Posts
316
Likes
287
Here’s the thing. A trade deficit simply shows that one country buys more stuff from another country than the other country buys from them.

Outside of Trump land, that’s just normal. Lots of folks here have underlined the insane costs to customers associated with trying to make cheap goods in North America. Mass market clothing and shoes, just for starters. Toys…

Let’s not forget that it was US companies who sent manufacturing to Asia, to take advantage of low wages, easier regulation, etc. Just so that US customers could spend a lot less, and prosper. I can’t count the number of times I heard the Shark Tank wizards telling new entrepreneurs to “find a factory in China; I can help…”.

Tariffs are US taxes on businesses that import stuff. Customers pay in the end. That is customers in the USA.

It appears that Mr Trump has decided today to reopen Alcatraz. That is nutbar level.
 
Posts
29,245
Likes
75,639
More than once, President of the United States Donald J Trump has stated immigration is wonderful. Just follow the legal process that all other countries in the world enforce.
Oh the irony...
 
Posts
1,774
Likes
7,017


Mr. Pdxleaf, approx. 7 million illegals crossed border 2020-2024. Tell us all how we go back and verify the identities and criminal pasts of the 7 million. Let say only 10% are criminals. 700,000 on American streets. Let us say 1%. 70,000 criminals on American streets. Your fine and dandy with this I assume. Biden process was fine, come on in, we don't care who you are.

More than once, President of the United States Donald J Trump has stated immigration is wonderful. Just follow the legal process that all other countries in the world enforce.
7 million in those years. 11 million during Trump's first 4.
 
Posts
23,486
Likes
52,213
Oh the irony...
Same guy who posted about people complaining about the process of an election when they don't like the results. ::facepalm1::
 
Posts
1,053
Likes
4,264
You are too kind, that wasn't even real data or research, just regurgitated talking points, e.g. comparing cherry-picked examples of high single-item tariffs to the overall average tariff charged by the US. And VAT ... come on, that's an across-the-board tax and totally irrelevant.
Golden that you’ve cited cherry-picking while quoting a response containing an infographic that was posted by a left-leaning dude on X. I was honestly looking for info this morning from (hopefully) unbiased sources. We’re all just watch friends around here having a healthy debate. So much for trying to educate myself on an issue I freely admitted I know little about…but I do appreciate the watch advice you give. Always good and appreciated.
 
Posts
3,666
Likes
7,786
So much for trying to educate myself on an issue I freely admitted I know little about…but I do appreciate the watch advice you give. Always good and appreciated.

Are you saying that you are going to stop researching this because of the way in which you have been criticized around what you said about trade deficit?
 
Posts
29,245
Likes
75,639
In other countries, do citizens demand election process be changed if they don’t like results ? Asking for a friend
Same guy who posted about people complaining about the process of an election when they don't like the results. ::facepalm1::
Yeah, forgot about that, thanks for the reminder...

I cannot speak for other countries, but here in Canada we have looked at the way elections are carried out in various jurisdictions several times in the last 20 years. It's not been driven by the losing party because of sour grapes as you would suggest, but an effort to make a more representative democracy.

Federally our last PM promised to change the system to some type of proportional representation (mixed member proportional, or ranked ballot - the latter would be my choice) but that getting a consensus from the other parties wasn't possible.

Where I live in Ontario m this process got to the point where a referendum was held on changing the voting system. In British Columbia, there have been 2 such votes in the last 20 or so years. So here at least,. how we elect our governments is not set in stone, and is open to improvement, provided that all parties agree.
 
Posts
2,779
Likes
14,818
7 million in thos

7 million in those years. 11 million during Trump's first 4.
11 million is the number of illegals in the country already.

Biden allowed 7 million INTO the country unvetted 2020-2024.
2016 to 2019 was approx 1.3 million.
Anyway, most here would not care until one broke in and raped or killed the wife or daughter. Then it would be a problem.
But since it not in their neighborhood they can keep head in the sand.
If your good with unvetted illegal immigration then great.

No other country in the world allows unvetted unchecked uncontrolled illegal immigration. US can be #1.
The US could be number #1 in legal immigration. Wait the US already is 1st in legal immigration, but hell who gives a shit.
Let anyone in no questions asked.

Let anyone vote, illegal or legal.

But make damn sure you provide government issued ID, current utility bill to get a library card to check out latest copy of Womans Day magazine.

Still waiting to hear about all the chaos in the country.