Omega cal. 1040 'prototype' 176.001 from a dealer

Posts
197
Likes
494
If I not wrong the 176.xxx are the first models using the 1040 movement.
So it would be also a prototype or pre-production of 1040 movement .
I would imagine that a prototype of 1040 will be based on a 1340 and will not be rose copper finished.

I'm surprised by the difference of achievement between the movement and the dial

No ?
 
Posts
1,819
Likes
5,923
Relative to the red circled 45 - my guess is that is for timing soccer match halves (using the central chronograph minute hand).
Yes, good point.
 
Posts
1,819
Likes
5,923
If I not wrong the 176.xxx are the first models using the 1040 movement.
So it would be also a prototype or pre-production of 1040 movement .
I would imagine that a prototype of 1040 will be based on a 1340 and will not be rose copper finished.

I'm surprised by the difference of achievement between the movement and the dial

No ?
That's a good point I hadn't considered. I have not seen the insides of a confirmed 1040 prototype. However, 1340/1341 would not have the 24 hour disc. So a fully functional prototype would require the Omega version of the movement.
 
Posts
3,998
Likes
9,018
If I not wrong the 176.xxx are the first models using the 1040 movement.
So it would be also a prototype or pre-production of 1040 movement .
I would imagine that a prototype of 1040 will be based on a 1340 and will not be rose copper finished.

That's a good point I hadn't considered. I have not seen the insides of a confirmed 1040 prototype. However, 1340/1341 would not have the 24 hour disc. So a fully functional prototype would require the Omega version of the movement.

A prototype of this supposed model of watch would not require a prototype ca.1040, in that it's possible that any 'prototyping' of a model could have been well after the introduction of the 1040 in several other models (.007, etc.).

Relative to the red circled 45 - my guess is that is for timing soccer match halves (using the central chronograph minute hand).

Assuming for the sake of argument (and not at all endorsing that assumption) this was in fact an Omega prototype, I would say this watch dial could have been a mock-up for the later and limited release FIFA, purportedly targeted at soccer/football referees. Ultimately that watch contained the cal.1045, and looked like this:

s-l640.jpg

My understanding is that when organizations sought a watch to adopt, various manufacturers would provide - essentially - 'bid' watches. For example, in 1978 Omega submitted to NASA for flight qualification three watches including a prototype/predecessor Alaska III based on the cal. 1045 (but, the 145.022 was selected); the next year, in 1979, FIFA also sought a watch to issue to referees and selected three, and Omega submitted another cal. 1045-based watch (and it was among a few officially adopted by FIFA and issued to their referees).

Now, I venture away from already sparse info and into pure fantasy: presumably, before submitting a watch to such an organization, Omega design would likely spitball various possible designs for submission. They may even from a pool of designs, select more than 1 to submit to the organization for consideration. Such a process in responding to design RFPs would be typical for many products.

Turning then to this watch (or more precisely, it's dial), the "45" at the 9 o'clock would be the primary support for any such view. One may stretch toward also the absence of the OMEGA logo as leaving space for FIFA design work, the lack of a line indication (speedmaster vs seamaster). By 1979, the cal. 1040 would be available (though near or past the end of it's more widely-used 'run'), as of course would be the case, blank case backs, etc., for purposes of creating a mock up. I'd also assume that such proposals by OMEGA would involve dials made one-off, rather than meeting full production quality control and tolerances.

So, it wouldn't be a pre-series mock-up or prototype, but a late-in-series (1978/9) mockup made to spitball designs for submission to FIFA.

That said, for the same reasons nothing about this specific watch for sale would be unique other than the dial. For the same reasons, with nothing but the dial, a person could build a full watch easily with existing parts on hand.

The above set out for sake of argument: bah. Absolute best case scenario would be a mock-up dial (and only the dial) for a design bid submission (which I think hardly qualifies as a 'prototype').

But, this watch altogether shows no signs of being even an Omega-made mock-up.

Those hands aren't reminiscent of anything in the Omega lineup at the time, and presumably any mock up for an organization like FIFA (in contrast to NASA) would have used largely parts on hand (excuse the pun) - as it turned out with the actual FIFA watch. And as previously mentioned by others on this thread, the hands on this watch (and I'll add all 4 central hands) are identical to the Tissot Navigator (why Omega would use those hands is the only thing MORE curious than why someone cobbling together this watch wouldn't have just used actual Omega hands). To that end, it's definitely not a "completely assembled prototype" as claimed by the seller.
 
Posts
1,819
Likes
5,923
So, it wouldn't be a pre-series mock-up or prototype, but a late-in-series (1978/9) mockup made to spitball designs for submission to FIFA.

That said, for the same reasons nothing about this specific watch for sale would be unique other than the dial. For the same reasons, with nothing but the dial, a person could build a full watch easily with existing parts on hand.

The above set out for sake of argument: bah. Absolute best case scenario would be a mock-up dial (and only the dial) for a design bid submission (which I think hardly qualifies as a 'prototype').

But, this watch altogether shows no signs of being even an Omega-made mock-up.
Reasonable! And yet I agree still unlikely. But I wouldn't mind if the seller described the watch the way you have. If it was priced the way a typical 176.001 should be I might even buy it as a curiosity. At their asking price and the way it's described...hell no.

Two months on and still no takers!
 
Posts
27
Likes
88
If I not wrong the 176.xxx are the first models using the 1040 movement.
So it would be also a prototype or pre-production of 1040 movement .
I would imagine that a prototype of 1040 will be based on a 1340 and will not be rose copper finished.

I'm surprised by the difference of achievement between the movement and the dial

No ?
I know of an Omega prototype which has a Lemania based movement, i.e. not copper/gold plated
 
Posts
5,598
Likes
9,424
The dial fits the typical dial manufacturers design samples with pre production flaws , shown to the watch manufacturers on request for a special purpose. They wanted to show the design and were part of the sales/ design teams, out for an contract. These dial manufacturers sample books were kept at the dial factories, but some Swiss dealers with good connections managed to buy them and here we are.....it is a design sample, not a production sample. Quite a few showed up lately with Tudor big block Chronos and some Rolex models. Real from the dial manufacturers, requested by the watch companies, but never adopted. Another little give away: the red aero plane center second 60 minute counter hand is too short. Most probably from an Orfina Porsche design Chrono. Kind regards. Achim
 
Posts
1,344
Likes
1,966
Just to add some thing to the other side of this argument, the hand engraved number on the lug I have seen on several 'prototype' or pre production Omega cases, so I am inclined to believe this is an Omega marking.
I think it is worth saying that all aeroplane centre minute counters are short, and although the chrono second hand does seem a little short for this dial I think it is because all 1040 dials have a rehaut while on this watch it is missing.
I agree that this is a pre production mock up, it may not have even had a movement, but who knows.