Hello All, I am new to the forum and I have read a lot of posts before making my first post. So I thought I would start with something different. I have not seen my Longines come up so far. If you are a Longines fan, like something different and like to research historical watch info please read on. I am sharing information on the Longines Weems Patent 2008734. There is lots on Weems and the hour angle but not much on this Patent. The 2008734 Patent is for the design of the rotating bezel. Please do read the actual Patent, I included the link below. The Patent is brilliant. If you are a Omega fan, sorry the Patent and other links suggest Longines and Weems were first with the rotating bezel. I have been told mine is a civilian version of the Weems. None the less I hope it provides some new information for the forum. Do read all the links and enjoy the photos. Longines Weems Patent 2008734 - “US Pat. 2008734”, this referring to Philip Weems’ original registration of his design as a pilot’s navigational aid in 1935. It has become known as the second setting watch. It is viewed as the watch that created the rotating bezel concept and therefore impacting the design of many watches thereafter. The Weems bezel invented by Professor Phillip Van Horn Weems is viewed as having a major impact on the design of early pilots’ watches and Weems is viewed as a man who contributed to the advancement of air navigation than anyone else in the early 1930’s. He worked for the US Naval Academy in Annapolis, Weems was brilliantly ingenious, and many of his techniques by which a pilot could relate his position to that of the stars while flying at night are still in use as standards today. Several books on the subject of in-flight navigation were authored by Weems and he received a Gold Medal from the International Aeronautic Federation. The celebrated trans-Atlantic flier Charles Lindberg studied under Weems before making his 1927 journey in Spirit of St. Louis, and indeed, he actually built on the bezel arrangement here to create an improved version by which hour angle calculations could be made. One of a number of Weems’ inventions was the second-setting watch. At sea, celestial sights had to be taken with the aid of a hack watch which was set to the ship’s chronometer. It was difficult, however, to set the watch exactly, which meant that it differed slightly from the chronometer, which in turn differed from Greenwich Mean Time. Weems reasoned that the difficulty in setting the watch came from the fact that at the time it was almost impossible to set the second hand exactly. However, if the second hand could not be set to match the dial perfectly, it might be possible to make the dial movable, so that the dial and the second hand were synchronized at the right time. The fact that Weems’ father-in-law was a patent attorney helped him considerably in getting the idea patented, but patent it he did, and he had dozens of claims based on the second -setting watch patent. The patent was “US Pat. 2008734”, this referring to Philip Weems’ original registration of his design as a pilot’s navigational aid in 1935. US Patent Office http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?docid=...1=2008734.PN.%26OS=PN/2008734%26RS=PN/2008734 http://www.weemsjohn.com/TheGrandoldManofNavigation.html The principle on which the Weems bezel operates is extremely simple, but like many such ideas, it is also very efficient and utterly foolproof. Something that hadn’t been as relevant in the age of sea travel, ultra-accurate timekeeping was of the utmost importance to the aviator. While a Lt. Commander in the US Navy, Weems realised that with flying speeds of between 200 and 300 miles per hour being regularly achieved even during the inter-war years, a slight error in followed that there emerged a requirement to be able to set a watch exactly, to the second, to a known time signal. Today, this task is achieved by means of so-called “hacking seconds”, this terms being the one used to describe the process of stopping a second hand at will, typically by pulling the winding crown out to its fullest extent. In 1929, when Weems devised his invention, the concept of stopping a movement on command had not yet appeared on a large scale, though theoretically at least, the first generation of watches with this featured had begun to be offered by this stage. Weems’ solution to the seconds synchronisation problem was a far better one, this being achieved by having a rotating bezel, calibrated in segments between 0 and 60. Therefore, at any time, the bezel could be instantly turned to align its vertical 0 position to coincide with its equivalent on any other time source. This method of setting was far easier to use, particularly when in mid-flight and synchronising to radio time signals, that the hacking seconds system of adjustment, and, a point that always seems to be overlooked, also resulted in far less mechanical strain on the movement in general, this not having to be stopped, paused and started again during the synchronising process. As an aside, it is also understandable, though not an obvious application, that many of these Weems pilots’ watches found a second career after being decommissioned from military life in the hands of radio and television broadcasters of the late 1940s, who found the ability to synchronise to the exact second invaluable when starting and ending transmissions. http://www.watchtime.com did some research into rotating bezel and dated it back to the above patent – “1929, when Philip Van Horn Weems applied for a patent for a wristwatch with a more complex external bezel, which was granted in 1935 and soon found its way on to many pilots’ watches, the most important one being the legendary Weems watch from Longines”. There are numerous print references to this model, in finding mention of this watch. Online watchtime created a really nice piece on the how the rotating bezel landed on a diving watch. http://www.watchtime.com/blog/dive-watch-wednesday-how-the-rotating-bezel-landed-on-the-dive-watch/ http://www.vintage-watches-collection.com/watch/longines/longines-steel-pilots-watch-with-weems-1943/ Gisbert Brunner’s “Wristwatches” devotes a full page (p. 274) to the reproduction of Philip Weems’ original drawings for this rotating bezel concept, describing it as an “apparatus for navigator’s time keeping”. On the opposite page, an almost identical Longines Weems to the one offered here is pictured in colour with the caption that this is a “pilot’s Longines Weems in steel, 1939, blocking, Calibre 10.68N “. “Wristwatches, A History of a Century’s Development” by Helmut Kahlert includes a photograph of this model on page 303 in a chapter entitled “Aviation, Observation and Military Watches”. The accompanying text informs us that “the outer glass can be locked by the knob by the 2”, this being incorrect. The glass remains static at all times, with the bezel only rotating and locking. One of the best references is on page 103 of Z.M Wesolowski’s “A Concise Guide to Military Timepieces”. An identical steel Longines Weems to the one offered here is pictured, accompanied by the note that “it was produced in 1940 by Longines, with a small number acquired by the Royal Air Force. It is known that at least one such watch was issued to the navigator of a Lancaster bomber in 1942. The back of the case bears no issue marks, but the dial is both signed Longines and Weems. Sotheby’s included a Longines Weems, stated as being from 1938 and apparently identical to the one here with the exception of it having a less desirable gold plated case, as Lot 136 in its 22nd February 1990 auction sale in London “Important Clocks, Watches and Wristwatches”. Daria Marozzi’s excellent 1990 book “Longines” includes a large full page colour plate of two of this exact stainless steel model side by side ( p. 87) in a section entitled “watches and instruments for aviation”. The major sources I would like to refer you to are: · The original Patent submission by Philip Weems http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?docid=...1=2008734.PN.%26OS=PN/2008734%26RS=PN/2008734 · The story of Weems and his impact on the world of navigation o http://www.weemsjohn.com/TheGrandoldManofNavigation.html · An online piece that details the impact of the rotating on watch design o http://www.watchtime.com/blog/dive-watch-wednesday-how-the-rotating-bezel-landed-on-the-dive-watch/ · My Pinterest page for photo’s of the watch and more historical images of this second setting watch and the hour Angle watch o https://uk.pinterest.com/craigparkermail/longines-weems-us-patent-2008734/
These are tiny little watches, even for that era, but are nice high quality pieces. Even I have one: This one has traces of the original red paint at the "60". Not sure if the dial is original or a redial, but the movement and case are certainly proper. The real rarity surrounding this piece is trying to find the original box. I've seen exactly one, but here is an old ad showing one: Great article. Thanks for the write-up! gatorcpa
gatorcpa you are right these are small. 27.5mm but very beautiful. I really like the advert. Nice post.
I recently helped a fellow collector to acquire a JLC Weems. The watch I located for him was lacking the bezel and locking crown but he had access to both of these. In fact, as with buses, it seems you wait forever and two come along at once. He's now got five of these beauties and I'm sure he wouldn't mind me sharing the photos:
dear jimmyd13 thank you for sharing. very nice. I am sure after the Dunkirk film the Omega and military ones will become very collectible.
They have been for some time. I know of one other of these for sale, complete, and the asking is in the region of £5000. They're not really something I'm drawn to but I can certainly see the appeal.
That is a lot more than the original price in this advert. $43.75 for the steel version. $49.75 for a Gold one!
The Fellows Catalogue for their Watch Sale on the 31st October has just come through the post. Fellows have assessed and added this watch to their catalogue. Quiet a prominent picture in their catalogue. I add this for information. Fellows have valued this between £1,100 - £1,600.
I wish you all the best with the auction Craig - having Tom Hardy as a poster boy for the Omega version recently won’t hurt your chances for achieving a great price!
The Fellows' Weems is expensive and tiny, 27 ish mm compared to the 33mm Weems in Zenith, Omega, Longines, Lecoultre and Movado examples. You can find the smaller ones far cheaper on the 'bay. Im not sure the dial on the Fellows example isn't a redial to boot.
Dear All, I said I would post an update when the Fellow's auction completed. The Weems went for £1,250 plus buyers commission. So thank you Nathan1967 and w154 for your support. LarryG, the dial had patina from the hands being stationary for a period of time. Probably from the radium on the hands. So possibly not a redial. Anyway looking out for something new and a little bit bigger.
Radium burn does not mean the dial is original, could be an old redial. I have one in my drawers on a 12L. Agree with @LarryG the dial could be refinished, the "Longines" logo appears overinked. Regs Edit/add By the way, I'm realizing the watch sold at auction is yours and the one in the OP. Isn't it against forum rules to promote a sale in which one has a stake ?
I did think it was a bit off, the watch was up for sale a few times on eBay over the summer before the thread was started here, but hey the first post was nice and informative so I think it all balances out.
Actually it's back on the 'Bay and the overinked font on the Longines logo clearly signals a refinished dial.... As for the £2,795.00 asking price, not bad for what was really a ladies watch.... (more info to follow). https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Longines-Weems-U-S-Military-Pilot-Watch-WWII-Stunning-Rare-Mint-1942/272924197431?_trkparms=aid=777003&algo=DISCL.MBE&ao=2&asc=49129&meid=911a4a5019e84a0fb5513541e779dfc7&pid=100012&rk=3&rkt=7&sd=282731585253&_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network