I pulled the trigger on my first Omega and it's a vintage one at that.

Most of my commentary here is directed at Newbies.

<rant mode on>
Even though I have less than a year here on OF, I grow increasingly intolerant of the newbie posts about “I just bought a vintage Omega” or “help me buy a vintage watch, I'm too lazy to do the learning necessary to avoid wasting my $$$”. Damn it, if I can spend the time and effort to learn about vintage watches, so should you. <rant mode off>

I joined OF in August of last year after lurking here for a month or so and have only now made my first vintage Omega purchase. And while I think I did OK given the $$$ I had to spend on this, I think if I waited a bit longer, I might have done even better.

I bought this watch via an ebay auction. The seller posted 5 pictures, not high-res, no movement shot, and not in clear focus. I did message the seller a request for better pics, and got a dial shot but no movement shot (seller said he could not remove case back). After evaluation of what info I did have, and taking into account that the seller would NOT accept a return, I set a maximum bid at about ¾ of what I thought the watch was worth, and left a proxy bid.

Much to my surprise, and some anxiety, I won the watch at 10% less than my max bid.

I assessed the value of the watch based on what I had seen other watches of this type, apparent age, and quality go for. Even without a movement calibre, or reference number, I could make an educated guess as what I was buying.

This was because I DID MY HOMEWORK before I made a bid.

One telltale sign for me was the single word “Swiss”, at the bottom of the dial. This indicated an American cased watch. There was also some question as to what the case material was. In one fuzzy seller pic, the 14k G.F. Hallmark on the back of the case was partially visible. The 14k part was barely legible, and the G.F could have been anything. So there was a small possibility that this was a solid gold case. However, I did NOT factor that into my bid. As it turned out, it's gold filled.

So here is my “new” vintage Omega Seamaster, with commentary about what's right, and what's wrong with my purchase.

The details:
Omega Seamaster
circa 1957 (Birth year watch for me if it is '57)
serial number 15,760,XXX marked OXG
calibre 500 17j automatic adjusted to 2 positions
original, unrefinished dial
Jonell 14k GF 34mm case

So this is clearly a Norman Morris, American cased Omega from the late 50's. The single “Swiss” on the dial, coupled with the Jonell case and the OXG export movement all seem to confirm this. If I have any of this wrong, please feel free to comment here and let me know.

And since it didn't happen without pics, here they are:

After arrival, with a little clean-up and minus the vintage metal stretch band that caused some wear and tear to the inner lug surfaces.

Nice clean case back.

Wrong crown

Jonell logo between the lugs:

The movement

All the debris/dis-coloration on the rotor is worrisome. I hope it's just residue from the gasket. The rest of the movement does not show this, and the finish is clean and bright. It is running and keeping time in the 2 hours I've had it on. Off to the spa next week.

Serial number:


Export mark:


Reference number and inside case back:

Again the corrosion/condition is worrisome, but I hope it cleans up at the spa. No service marks that I can see.
Perhaps that explains the condition of the rotor and case back.

On a new milk chocolate suede strap:


And finally, on my wrist, where it belongs:


The good, the bad, and the ugly:

Good:
Original dial, original case, and match between dial, case, and movement suggesting a Norman Morris American cased watch.
circa 1957 serial number
calibre 500 movement.
Even patina (I think it looks good for a 61 year old watch)
Bad:
The flaking of the last 3 letters in automatic and the G in Omega.
Ugly:
Rotor and inside case back. Hopefully after service a different story.

As always, comments and helpful critique are welcome.
So newbies, do your homework, spend the time and see if you can do better!

 

Congrats .I bought a 13zn12 my first month here.Lol.. Did you buy the watch to restore?

 

To give this thread any credibility you need to disclose how much you paid.

 

You did your homework - but only partially.

because you forgot one of the most important rules: never buy a watch without a movement shot unless it is below $150

The stuff you call debris is corrosion, and no, it will not clean up because you cannot clean up corrosion...

 

I sure hope the newbies learn from your experience

 

OK fair enough.
$270. My watchmaker will service this for $150 plus parts if needed. A Omega crown should cost about $40,
So all in I think I'll be in this watch about ~$450.

 

I've seen Seamsters of this era with the round "S" and long "r", and with the hook "S" and short "r", but never with a regular "S" and short "r".

But, I haven't seen them all. Someone more experienced than myself may have seen this combo many times over.

It would be interesting to know what you paid. Shame about the movement though.

 

Thanks for sharing, would love to see pictures after the spa!

 

Yeah, after a closer look you may be correct. But although it looks terrible, so far it's not affecting the time-keeping of the watch.
The rest of the the movement looks very clean, and is functioning correctly.
And after service the rotor may look ugly, but if it still functions correctly, then I am OK with that result.
I did not buy the watch for re-sale or for investment. I bought it to wear. So I can happily live with a discolored/corroded rotor as long as it
doesn't affect the action of the watch.

 

Will do!

 

Congratulation wear and enjoy it

 

Is this a widely accepted perspective? Obviously there’s much more risk without a movement shot but I feel like the the saying “fortune favors the bold” applies as well. Many watches, especially on eBay, seem to be sold by people who just don’t know anything about watches and therefore don’t know to get a movement shot. Obviously you have to try to differentiate these from a person/dealer just being sketch..

I’m curious how others balance this risk?

 

I believe it all depends on who the seller is as well. Sometimes gambles work, and if they do, great! If not then accept a loss and see if what you have is worth investing in more or passing it on.

@Looneytoons - not a bad piece you've picked up and sure it will look good after the service. What's important is that you like it: remember there's also @ConElPueblo's thread Learn How To Fish to read up on.

 

So I frequently buy watches over $150 without a movement shot and have only gotten burned once. With that said, you lay down your money and you take your chances. In fact, I picked up a US Army Air Corps watch recently without a movement shot. Didn’t rest easy until I saw the engraving on the bridge.

The general condition of the watch tends to be a good indicator, but it isn’t perfect.

 

@GuiltyBoomerang - that makes sense, usually a glance through the sellers other items or simple question or two goves decent sense of their knowledge.

@Rumar89 - I try to keep in my head discounts in what I’m willing to pay with no movement shot, poor photo quality, etc. Usually it takes a watch in otherwise decent condition to make it worthwhile.

..Or I have to be really excited about the watch in which case it’s probably poor judgement..

 

An instructive thread and should be required reading for all the new arrivals who seem to find themselves with full bladders at the OF front door.

 

@seekingseaquest - It depends on the watch. How rare is it? Do you need it just for parts? Is the rest in good shape? Do you already have a donor caliber for it just in case? Lots of factors, but several of us have no issue rolling the dice.

 

nice watch. Enjoy it! Dont forget some pics after the spa!

 

If you like it ..That's all that matters bro.. Enjoy it.

 

Isn't that a pretty obvious redial? I consider myself a newbie despite being a member for a while and, using my best judgement, I just don't see any other explanation for the Omega/automatic text (doesn't look lined up properly)....or maybe it is just the angle of the photo?