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WITHDRAWN: Vintage Omega Speedmaster "CB" 105.012-66.. as original as you will find.

  1. Varnado Mar 23, 2017

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    I have been holding this watch back for a few weeks waiting for an Omega Archive to arrive from Bienne
    to confirm what I already knew.. that this watch is 100% Original. The only thing I have changed or I believe to have ever been changed is the crystal AND I even kept the original crystal just in case the buyer wanted to have it :). I just remembered the rubber case back gasket was also replaced, but I didnt keep the old one.

    Gorgeous Dial. Not relumed. Gorgeous matching hands, Not relumed.
    Omega B2 32 point wide logo crown (MWO) and short stem pushers.
    Exceptionally nice DON Dot Over 90 Bezel with no damage.
    UNPOLISHED case. I know I am opening myself up to comments so, go ahead. Its unpolished look and see.
    Original CB Facets are clear and defined on the Lugs and the Case is FAT.
    Brand New Omega Crystal replaced one that was not in the best of shape.
    Caseback engravings show a 105.012-66 with CB stamp. Confirmed by Archive
    Inner caseback and outer Hippocampus engravings are sharp and clear.
    Movement is 24,955,XXX which is correct for a 66/67 and Confirmed by Archive to be ORIGINAL to watch
    Production was August 21, 1967 and delivered to the US according to the Archive.
    Bracelet is a 1039 stamped 2/67 which correctly corresponds with Archive and has 516 Endlinks.
    All Bracelet springs are working and cosmetically excellent. Bracelet is long, no missing links.

    Please note that the new crystal is protected by a thin sheet of vinyl. In some of the photos you may see dust
    or bubbles that appear to be "on" the dial. They are not on the dial they are air bubbles below the vinyl.
    Dial is flawless and I even showed a pic or two of the watch out of the case. New owner can peel away the vinyl and know that the crystal is 100% clean and free of scratches.


    In addition, the watch was sold to me with an inner and outer Red Omega box and some
    additional nick nacks from the time of purchase making this nearly a complete set.

    Watch was timed and calibrated, it did not require a full service only an adjustment.
    Please see timing slip showing it is running 1.2 seconds slow per day which is outstanding. (See X on paper)
    No service needed, just adjust the bracelet and you are ready to wear it.

    So, now you want to know how much for all of this loveliness?
    $14,995 shipped fully insured anywhere in the world by Parcel Pro and Fedex.
    Bank Wire or local pick up only in the New York City area.

    If you need any references on how perfect my watches are, I am hoping some of my customers will chime in...
     
    51037611617__C10CF898-5A5E-47E9-A8F5-C956A34F155D.jpg Archive.ED.jpg IMG_6955ED.jpg IMG_6956ed.jpg IMG_6959ed.jpg IMG_7026.jpg IMG_7027.jpg IMG_7028.jpg IMG_7030.jpg IMG_7031.jpg IMG_7032.jpg IMG_7033.jpg IMG_7282.jpg IMG_7283.jpg IMG_7284.jpg IMG_7286.jpg IMG_7288.jpg IMG_7289.jpg IMG_7290.jpg IMG_7291.jpg IMG_7292.jpg IMG_7293.jpg IMG_7294.jpg IMG_7296.jpg IMG_7297.jpg IMG_7298.jpg IMG_7299.jpg Screen Shot 2017-03-23 at 6.53.57 PM.jpg Screen Shot 2017-03-23 at 6.55.01 PM.jpg
  2. corn18 Mar 23, 2017

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    MeWow!
     
  3. gemini4 Hoarder Of Speed et alia Mar 23, 2017

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    I have seen this 105.012-66 CB in the flesh and it is truly an excellent example.
     
  4. kov Trüffelschwein. Mar 24, 2017

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    Wow ! Good luck with selling :thumbsup:
     
  5. FraenkTheTank Mar 24, 2017

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    Beautiful watch. Just one question. Is the minute hand oringinal?! The tip looks different to what I am used to?!

    Frank
     
  6. Varnado Mar 24, 2017

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    Interesting observation Frank. Omega like Rolex did some peculiar things back in the 60's. I have seen unusual and unique hands on Vintage Rolex watches before that is unexplained and was never documented in any literature, but is considered to be 100% accurate.

    In the case of this minute hand I look at several factors..

    1. The color of the lume..
    It matches perfectly so I believe this is how it came from the factory. The dial plots also match the hand plots perfectly so I believe the whole set is as it was when it left the factory. Could it have been relumed? Yes, but not likely to be this perfect and if so why not relume a hand that is known to be accurate instead of one that is unique?

    2. The color of the white paint on the hand itself..
    If the hand was replaced at some time during service, it would most definitely have a different color white paint on it. When they come as a set they age as a set and everything is identical or very similar in color. ( unless there is water or moisture damage) The paint matches the other hands perfectly.

    3. The decay rate, or glow decay..
    This is probably a new one for those of you who dont deal in vintage watches for a living/passion. In English, when a hand is replaced or relumed the decay rate will not match. In other words, an old hand will glow less bright and remain glowing for a shorter period of time than a newer replacement. I have attached a photo of the hands charged with UV light and you will see they match identically and the decay rate is also identical.

    4. Why one hand?
    If a watch is 100% original from the factory then why replace only one hand? Could it have been damaged? Perhaps, but then all of the above factors would apply. It is most likely an anomaly from Omega and the hand matches too perfectly to have been replaced. It is certainly unique but, it fits on the pinion so it has to be an Omega hand and nothing else can be explained. Maybe it was a manufacturing error but, that is a long shot.

    To quote a well known member who texted me "Who knows, (it's) an omega mystery." IMG_7319.JPG
     
  7. watchtinker Mar 25, 2017

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    Gentlemen, what bothers an old watchmaker like me is not the fact that, presumably, a colleague might have not noticed that the winding crown is not original to the watch, but the fact that the lift angle has been erroneously set at 52° degrees instead of 40° degrees. In such a manner the maximum amplitude is shown to be 348°, which is simply not possible because the watch should have been overbanking!
    Please, correct the readings.
     
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  8. Varnado Mar 25, 2017

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    Watchtinkerer: While I'm sure your intentions are good and I have nothing to hide, this sort of comment should have been made via PM. For some reason my posts always seem to draw this sort of "thread crapping" which I contribute to members trying to show how smart they are.

    According to MWO, the crown is correct for the watch. I even referred to it in my original post. (please see photo). And while everyone expects a flat foot crown to be correct, there are many reasons why THIS crown is correct and original. First off, it isn't a service crown and was produced in the 1960's. Of even more importance, and why I LOVE archives, is that this watch was assembled in LATE 1967. Guess what crown was used on 67 models and watches produced in 67... The B2 32. So, while the flat foot is the crown used PRIOR to 67 produced models as OEM, many models produced in 67, especially in late 67, used the B2. Guess I'm the one trying to show how smart I am now, huh?

    As far as the lift angle being improperly entered, you are correct. This particular machine (one of 3 my watchmaker uses) does not auto detect lift angle and requires it to be manually entered. Since you can see it says Rolex on the print out, you should also know that 52 degrees is correct for Rolex Sport models and he forgot to change the setting. I am going back there RIGHT NOW to have the watch retested with a new print out. I will post it in a few hours.

    In conclusion, your post eludes to my trying to be clever or in some way dishonest when I am the most thorough and detailed collector and seller I know of. You are wrong about the crown and the degree setting was an honest mistake by my watchmaker. I am curious to see how the new setting will effect the end results. I doubt very much..

    PS: Watchmaker stated that banking would most likely occur at 360 amplitude and higher so, that is why at 348 it was NOT banking and he saw no evidence of banking. That combined with the fact that his machine was set at the wrong lift angle showed an amplitude higher than it actually was. Running to watchmaker now, will respond later. IMG_7370.JPG
     
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  9. watchtinker Mar 25, 2017

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    Dear Sir,

    I am really sorry that my comments seem to have inesplicably upset you and I sincerely beg your pardon for this.

    In my experience this type of crown does not match the serial number of the movement and the early dial with narrow "T Swiss Made T". However, while I frankly do not see the importance of the matter on the whole, if the book you are making reference reassures your conviction I do not understand the relevance of my words.

    However, please let me point out two simple things, based on physical facts: first, the lift angle, by its own nature, cannot be auto detected; second, overbanking, on account of simple geometry, does not occur at 360° degrees of amplitude (or even higher! :() but at obviously lower magnitudes.

    Again, I am sorry I for my comments but my attention was simply attracted by the uncorrect measurement.

    Best wishes,

    Maurice
     
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  10. Varnado Mar 25, 2017

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    Maurice, the book I am referring to is called Moonwatch Only. It is a fairly well known book and is used as a reference for many collectors like myself, when purchasing or selling a watch to verify that its parts are genuine, original and/or correct.

    Since you once again decided to make this a public post in spite of my request to send me a private message, I feel compelled to once again respond publicly in order to dispel any notion that I have something to hide or refuse to address your comments.

    You stated that "this type of crown does not match the serial number of the movement and the early dial with narrow "T Swiss Made T"
    You further stated that "frankly do not see the importance of the matter on the whole". Well, if you don't see the importance than why bring it up at all? The importance is that you are questioning the part on the watch as not being original and my heading that the watch is essentially 100% original into play. You force me to defend myself and my watch, so that is what I am going to do.

    My serial number is a 24,955,XXX. In this attached photo from the same book, you will see that the reference that immediately followed my watch was a 145.012-67. According to the same book, the serial number range for this model is 24,066,XXX- 26,554,XXX. Please notice the overlap. While your self proclaimed experience with the movement numbers doesn't recognize a 24.9 million movement as being able to have a B2 crown, the MWO book does. In fact, they recognize this 67 model and the serial of 24.0 million (nearly 1 million movements earlier in production) to be factory installed with B2 crowns. So, why is it so hard to believe that my watch produced in late 67 couldn't or wouldn't have a B2 crown? And why is it that the crown on my watch happens to be a B2 crown out of all of the possible crowns that could be "wrong" and also happens to be the crown actually used in 1967 by Omega on Speedmasters? Think about that while I move on to the movement...

    I would like to thank you for bringing the calibration error to my attention and the attention of my watchmaker. Why? Because after changing the lift angle setting on his machine to the correct 40 degrees for Omega (from 52 degrees for Rolex) the watch now runs at ZERO seconds a day fast/slow. Absolutely dead on with no variations from fast or slow. It runs perfectly. Yes, the amplitude is now lower (and well within Omega range) but, that was to be expected once we corrected the lift angle setting on his machine.

    I hope you have found this to be an informative an educational post and in no way do I mean to discredit you or demean your knowledge.

    IMG_7386.JPG fullsizeoutput_4e8.jpeg
     
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  11. watchtinker Mar 25, 2017

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    I am well aware of Moonwatch Only, whose authors have made resort to the help of well known dealers, collectors and friends of mine and I am pleased that you keep it on your table.
    Thank you for providing the updated measurement to the community. It is a meritorious act that few people do and may help to educate a vast audience on paying closer attention to the condition of the movement in vintage watches.
    Best wishes,
    Maurice
     
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  12. TNTwatch Mar 25, 2017

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    Do the numbers on the 3rd column of the reading denote the beat errors?
     
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  13. watchtinker Mar 26, 2017

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    They do.
     
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  14. gemini4 Hoarder Of Speed et alia Mar 26, 2017

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    Edited Mar 26, 2017
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  15. Varnado Mar 26, 2017

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    The crown IS original as I have stated from the start, but thank you Gemini4. When you say it I suppose it carries more weight..

    ONLY the CB cases should have the B2 crown and even in the CB cases only the late production watches should.
    My research has shown that 24.9 is about the cut off point where Omega switched out the Flat Foot with B2.
    ANY 25m 105.012-66 SHOULD have the B2. IMO if it has a Flat Foot that late in production it was installed privately.

    I have seen 24.9 watches with both so, this is where I figured the switch out took place. Just my observation..
    Hey MWO publishers.. when you make revision #3 make sure you give me credit (and Gemini4) for pointing this out :)
     
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  16. smitty190373 Mar 26, 2017

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    I bought a watch from @Varnado earlier in the year.

    He was extremely helpful from start to finish. Buy with confidence...he's a good guy :thumbsup:.

    Watch looks great...glws.
     
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  17. TNTwatch Mar 26, 2017

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    Well, these and the amplitude numbers speak louder that the minute hands and the crown.
     
  18. marturx Mar 26, 2017

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    OK, buyer of my watch, apparantly the crown was original on my watch, and not a later replacement as I stated in my ad, so pls send an extra 500$, thank you! :D

    And thank you @gemini4 for reminding me of selling it far too cheap...:whistling:
     
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  19. Varnado Mar 26, 2017

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    Honestly, I think having the B2 is even more unique because it is a crown rarely seen on this model and only installed on this model in very small numbers just like the CB case.

    If after reading all of this the potential buyer still wants a Flat Foot Crown, I have no problem obliging with a swap. I have a few lying around that I could have easily changed it with if I thought it didnt come from Omega this way :)

    PS: I will not respond to any PM's to sell them, so dont bother..

    IMG_7083.JPG
     
  20. Varnado Mar 26, 2017

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    Almost forgot.. Thanks Smitty I appreciate the comment and hope you are still loving the watch. That was a rare beauty indeed.

    Wear it in good health my friend..
     
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