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Etiquette regarding outing inaccurate watch posts...

  1. M'Bob Ω 2

    M'Bob Jul 22, 2017

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    I see incorrect information on a variety of different venues that sell watches. My tact has always been to drop the seller a quick email, and let them know what and why I think something they are communicating, either through words or pictures, is inaccurate.

    I think often (but not always), it's difficult to assess whether some is being nefarious, sloppy, rushed, or ignorant of certain facts, but I default to giving them benefit of the doubt whenever possible. I would hope someone would extend to me the same courtesy.

    But is this old-fashioned, and not reflective of the Internet age? Is it okay to just make assumptions about people's intent, until proven otherwise? Or should we all engender, in a medium that offers a lot of security against retribution, to be a little kinder and gentler?
     
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  2. Tony C. Ω 2

    Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jul 22, 2017

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    Assume the worst. Guilty unless proven innocent. :D
     
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  3. gemini4 Ω 2

    gemini4 Hoarder Of Speed et alia Jul 22, 2017

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    I message ebay sellers frequently and point out inaccuracies, some glaring, in their offerings.

    Some thank me and pull, or correct their listing. Some ignor the message. Some tell me to f@€k off. Once a seller is informed, their actions speak volumes regarding their original intent.

    For example this jerk, a tee shirt trader, with the bogus 105.012 dial previously discussed here, has (so far) chosen to ignor me. As he has been alerted by others as well, I suppose he hits the nefarious column.

    Ebay seller finally contacted me and claimed he will notify winning buyer of dial issue and offer to cancel. Claims ebay fees are too high if he pulls listing.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/112484365705Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network
     
    Edited Jul 22, 2017
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  4. Oku

    Oku Jul 22, 2017

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    It is not old-fashioned, it is correct. "the medium offers a lot of security against retribution" is no reason to use it like a pillory.

    However, sometimes the descriptions of watches are so obviously wrong made by dealers who should know it better, that it is useless to drop them a line in advance. For example, this guyPurchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network regularly sells vintage watches. First thing is, he states that he does it as a private seller. This is very doubtful. Secondly, he should really know if a dial is original or not. The description is obviously wrong and misleading.
     
  5. dsio Ω 2

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    On that point of etiquette, when the seller makes a clear and rather obvious amateur grade mistake after a series of similar ones, then rather than even attempt to correct it starts making demands on a watch forum that the thread pointing it out be deleted, then failing that hits up his good friend to create a "counter-thread" about how unfair it is because of the "tone" used, still having made zero effort to correct the actual listing that started it all in the first place... at what point does it start to seem that the accuracy of those listings is far less important to the seller than the "perceived" accuracy of them?

    Incidentally, that theoretical seller may do well to read up on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect as the thread he's getting upset over has hardly any views and no replies, and thanks to his friend its likely to now have a drastically increased number of replies and far more exposure when otherwise nobody was likely to notice it.
     
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  6. Bill Sohne Ω 2

    Bill Sohne Bill @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    Hi Bob

    First off ..... " Dealers " , "Experts" etc.... are held to a higher level then a "Private citizen" ...

    Before I go any further.... I have a question for you bob.. As I dont think we ever met or done a deal before.

    Are you associated with any " Dealers " or " Experts" that in anyway that might compromise you view?

    Just to put it out there...

    I have been collecting for many years. I am considered more then a hobbyist by some. I also happen to me a moderator on this forum as well.

    I have seen and experienced many dealer interactions... that was on both sides of this issues...
    I remember a great experience with a west coast seller Richard Page at Paris1925 in SF. Hey had a watch on there site simple 14k gold Omega manual wind. I emailed them to place it on hold and I would call when they opened to give credit card info. Well when I called and talked a representative answered the phone. They went to get the watch, she had the watchmaker open the case... I was asking for the s/n for my records.. that is when she said " opps, we made a mistake". She then continued " The watch is actually 18k not 14k.., but we already have a deal and the watch is yours so not to worry. ".

    That stuck with me for many years... Someone made a bonehead mistake on the sellers part ... they accepted responsibility and moved on as if nothing has happened.

    I have also seen the flip slide of this... with a dealer ...... With an early Omega Pilots watch using the 1927 Lufwaffa pattern. 38 mm wire lugs elongated onion crown etc..... Dealer said it was good to go... I got it FEDEX... as soon as I got it out of the box I know I was in trouble,. I drove to the watchmaker... Lets start it off , the dial in place with double stick tape! I had a long conversation with someone at that dealer., it was a deaf ears. They said it was fine. and all original . She would not hear of any tape on the dial or broken winding wheel teeth, ( looked like a jack-o lantern . I just said I am return the watch as I did not like it .... that she understood.


    I hold dealers to a higher level , certain dealers I only go to their sites when someone asks me to take a look at something.. I never go on my own accord.

    There are dealers out there that I feel comfortable sending friends and family too cause I know how he or she is ...

    When I have time I try to point stuff out, but after awhile of doing that and no one would reply or comply .....

    I would rather limited time here and read the forums... and add value to others questions and answers...


    Your milage may vary !

    Good Hunting

    Bill Sohne


     
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  7. nonuffinkbloke

    nonuffinkbloke #1 Nigel Mansell Fan Jul 22, 2017

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    Blimey... gonna make a cup of tea and keep an eye on this one chaps.::popcorn::
     
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  8. Bill Sohne Ω 2

    Bill Sohne Bill @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    Move along nothing to see here !!!

    hahahahahahaha


     
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  9. dsio Ω 2

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    Finally the listings in question are now removed.
     
    Uniqez likes this.
  10. UncleBuck Ω 2

    UncleBuck understands the decision making hierarchy Jul 22, 2017

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    If I judge an honest oversight or mistake, the pm asking for clarification or retraction may be in order. It gives the party a
    chance to respond to and likely, point out my error.
    If there is a questionable pattern developing or any evasive or defensive moves, then I adopt the nuclear option.

    May I add that I view the "For Sale" section here should be held to a higher standard and a quicker "out".
     
    Edited Jul 22, 2017
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  11. M'Bob Ω 2

    M'Bob Jul 22, 2017

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    You apparently feel very comfortable making a number of assumptions, and stating them as facts.

    Ken is hardly a "good friend," neither did he "hit me up" to write my post. If you recall, I took a similar tone the first time it happened, and have actually taken a similar stance when someone did the same thing with Hodinkee, whom I've never communicated with nor purchased anything from, unlike Ken.

    My post stands on its own - you either agree with my position, or don't. Either way is fine...
     
  12. dsio Ω 2

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    I withdraw my assumptions entirely!

    I'll just assume its a total co-incidence that you guessed the person I was referring to but didn't name on the first try and also purely by chance that your thread came only an hour after his attempt to have the thread deleted and subsequent complaints were made.

    I'm still not deleting it by the way, since you're not friends I'll probably have to let him know separately.
     
  13. M'Bob Ω 2

    M'Bob Jul 22, 2017

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    Dude, take a chill pill. I never said we didn't communicate about it, and I read it, just as when it happened a year earlier, and had the identical reaction and response, unprompted.

    By the way, it's not just dealers that are supposed to be held to a higher standard of conduct...moderators too. I don't think I'm being inaccurate when I point out that your tone is unnecessarily snarky.
     
  14. dsio Ω 2

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    That's the second time today I've had someone give me a tone assessment on a forum post, maybe its a feature we should build in sort of like a mood ring.

    Yea, I figured that from the first post what with mind reading being a fairly difficult art only practiced by mothers and wives and you falling into neither of those categories. I would however have started the original post off with something to the effect of "So I was having a chat to my not necessarily good friend but acquaintance Ken about some difficulties he was having... and it got me thinking" so that way the cards would have been on the table from the start.
     
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  15. UncleBuck Ω 2

    UncleBuck understands the decision making hierarchy Jul 22, 2017

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    Moderator is a lot like kindergarten teacher. You love, you nurture and occasionally, you recognize a "little johnny" that has a spunkiness and a twinkle in his eye that experience has taught you how to handle.
    Now, you may be wrong but "little johnny" is doomed to a certain scrutiny whether he likes it or not.
    It's entirely possible that johnny might be subjected to a little unfair, not politically correct, extra watching,
    but after all.....
    the safety of the kindergarten is at stake!
     
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  16. Bill Sohne Ω 2

    Bill Sohne Bill @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    hmmm.... UB

    sounds very high and lofty for me....

    I just try to be moderate... I cant speak for others....
    Good Hunting

    Bill
     
  17. UncleBuck Ω 2

    UncleBuck understands the decision making hierarchy Jul 22, 2017

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    I just try to fathom the scope of being a moderator!

    That may be the definition of love for this hobby.
     
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  18. Bill Sohne Ω 2

    Bill Sohne Bill @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    you put a smile on my face Buck!

    non watch photo !!! and I dont have that many Chelsea Clocks Ash...

    IMG_5870.JPG.jpg
    good Hunting

    bill
     
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  19. nonuffinkbloke

    nonuffinkbloke #1 Nigel Mansell Fan Jul 22, 2017

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    I thought you said there was nothing to see Bill?::confused2:: it's nearly 3am here in the UK... Can I go to sleep yet?::popcorn::
     
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  20. Bill Sohne Ω 2

    Bill Sohne Bill @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2017

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    Hmmmm sure

    Good night bud!! I will wait till tomorrow

    Hahahah

    Bill
     
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