I've been building up a database of potential no reserve auctions in my watchlist to see how things look over time, get practice at assessing redials, etc. One thing that popped out to me was I seem to get semi-frequent notifications of relistings, even on watches that were sold to a winning bidder (I don't recall any reserves being attached to these listings).

I've seen talk on here of sellers using other ghost accounts to pump up bidding activity - are these relistings cases where they inadvertently won their own auction and needed to relist the item? Are there any good reasons a seller would need to relist an item or should that be a red flag for me?

 

It is not uncommon for auctions to be ended early, then re-listed due to an error in the original listing. Of course more frequently the reason is that they were sold to people who made private offers.

It is also the case that, at times, a watch will "sell" to a shill bidder, and then be re-listed in hopes of getting a higher price from a "live" bidder.

It is good practice to contact the seller and ask the reason for the re-listing. If the answer is compelling, they may deserve the benefit of the doubt. Obviously those who re-list sold watches with any frequency should be treated with suspicion.

 

I agree with Tony. Some re-listings are legitimately due to errors, non-paying winners, or a deal that fell through. This does happen. However, if it happens frequently to the same seller it's suspicious. Also, you can look at the bidding pattern to see if it is consistent with shill bidding (e.g. bidders with low feedback scores).

 

I've had to relist a lot of auctions this year because of non paying bidders. It's frustrating to have a listing end with a sale and then never hear from the buyer again.

I don't mind if some contacts me to ask about a re-listing because that has occasionally resulted in a BIN sale.

 

Non paying bidders are apparently fairly common. I've dropped out of auctions only to see the item re-listed. At least 2 sellers I follow then will publish the handle of the non-paying bidder - for whatever good that does. Both of these sellers I regard as honest and legit.

I had one seller try to give me a "second chance" to buy based on what he claimed was a non-paying bidder bid. That bid was around 25% more than my high bid. I told him I would pay my last bid as that was my high end, no more. He refused and eventually relisted. Ended up selling for less by a significant amount. I strongly suspected a couple of shills in that first listing. Both were zero accounts that swapped several bids in the last hour.

 

Classic shill-bid strategy.

 

I would have told him the highest bid that didn't involve the "winning" bidder in the running. Why pay more because of a non-serious bidder...

 

From a couple hundred eBay sales (never watches though) I’ve found buyers don’t pay up around 5% of the time.

 

That's going to be the same price, usually, as eBay is a second-price auction format: the winning bidder pays just one "notch" more than what the second-highest bidder was willing to pay. So if the top bidder drops out and you were second, the "right" price is not what your top bid was (which will be almost as high as the auction's closing price), it should be the lowest amount that would have been sufficient to outbid the third-place bidder. However, I suspect that sellers won't always see it that way.

 

You are not mentioning the Asian-Technique. The watch is relisted for a higher amount than the previous no sale listing. I am talking with a seller right now (not in Asia) that relisted for a higher amount after the previous listing did not sell. It is currently a buy it now or make offer listing. I offered him less than the starting amount of the previous auction listing that did not get any bids. He countered with a price well above his previous listing. When I disclosed I had been watching the watch for weeks and that my offer reflected the lack of interest due to his previous pricing he went radio silence.

 

I have seen this many times in Japan, somehow many end up selling. I'm always interested in if they found the sucker to buy it or just discount it to market pricing.

 

OK, maybe I am a cynic, but I have a theory that there are some Japanese sellers who sell under more than one eBay name, and they use some of their accounts to list watches at outrageously high prices, which makes their watches sold under other accounts look like bargains.

 

Unfortunately the practice of shill bidding and ghost accounts has been happening on Ebay since day one. I don't think that Ebay do enough about the practice as they will get their fee one way or another if the listing sells, but if the winning bid was a bogus bidder or a non-payer, they can cancel the transaction without paying any fee and just re-list again, so it helps the seller if it is a genuine error or non-payer but unfortunately helps the dis-honest seller who is bumping up the price, as they can re-list again without any penalty.

I'm afraid it is up to the community and yourself to try and identify the bogus bidding patterns. Bid what you would be willing to pay, if you win, great.

 

Oh, I don't think you're being a cynic at all. I've seen the same watch listed by multiple sellers at the same time. Not sure whjat they were trying to accomplish with this technique...

 

Most of this discussion is about eBay auctions. There is also 'but it now' which sellers often relist if the item runs its 30 day course and doesn't sell.

 

Classic shill-bid strategy.. I also seen it many time. The seller has a friend etc and ask to bid on his item..Of course I think are cases where the buyer didn't pay but most of them..shill-bid strategy.

 

Irrespective of the reasons why an item didn't sell, it is a genuine reason why an item shows as 'ended' in ones watch list, and is then relisted. Not because the buyer flaked or there are any issues with the seller.

 

I can't recall the seller but a few years ago there was a U.K. seller who frequently listed vintage Omegas. I bud on several of these and was under bidder several times. On each occasion I received a second chance offer.

It was still a reasonable price and I wanted the watch but I was 99% certain the seller was shilling up the price then sending out second chance offers to the under bidder. I couldn't bring myself to accept the offer.