Forums Latest Members
  1. Socks Sep 10, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092
    Hi guys, would like you opinion on this watch on eBay. More really for the information and my learning process.

    Seller suggests it’s a 1968 year watch but surely it’s assembly date is the governing factor and floating around 75.

    Photos infer using MWO extracts that the early serial could be explained by way of early steel brake movements (as opposed to a Delrin brake) being fitted into 145.022-74 pieces. (But the description doesn’t mention anything about it). Also, a bit too much flannel for my liking!!

    Movement looks clean, particularly around the pusher stems, which would back up the recent service claim (although you would expect to see a receipt for one so recent). Everything else looks consistent with a 74, but hey! What do I know?

    Would like your opinions, thanks in anticipation.

    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0mpre=https://www.ebay.co.uk/ulk/itm/183948270422

    9BD2BA85-9EB2-4629-A97F-24435AABE7F0.png EA073205-FF97-4E27-9541-F296592D9CFB.png 648492D5-027C-4A8D-B70F-F16AF6D643DE.png E5498AB6-CDDD-4C30-9B88-8533D4EC07EA.png
     
    Edited Sep 11, 2019
  2. abrod520 Sep 10, 2019

    Posts
    11,218
    Likes
    35,254
    That serial number would better fit a 145.022-68, but I'll bet it's from a Seamaster chrono
     
    Socks, Spacefruit and Taybharr like this.
  3. Davidt Sep 10, 2019

    Posts
    10,309
    Likes
    17,881
    Already a thread on this watch I believe but yes, movement is too early for the watch.
     
    Socks and Spacefruit like this.
  4. Socks Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092
    Davidt,

    Thanks & sorry if I've duplicated. I did have a good look before posting as I would have thought this may have been floated before my slow uptake. I can't find it - wondered if you could point me in the direction?

    Yes, the movement is too early for the watch, but does the WMO given reason stack up or is this just an excuse for people to mix & match references & movements? (admittedly an Extract would find them out)
     
  5. padders Oooo subtitles! Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    8,931
    Likes
    13,873
    I cant get that link to work so forgive me for commenting blind but...

    There certainly are some -74s out there with oddly low numbers, more than can be explained by movement swaps alone but in this case I would think it incumbent on the seller to prove this by getting an extract. It should be he making the effort not the buyer, after all it could just be a swapped movement as noted above, not even from a Speedy at all. I wouldn't touch one of these oddball combo watches without an extract personally, why take the risk, its not like the -74 is all that rare or special. He can't have it both ways, either it is a straight -74 with a quirky movement number, or it is a Franken if he is claiming it is a -68. I would think a legit extract as a ~1975 delivered watch would adds its cost and more to the watch value so you have to ask why the seller hasn't gone for one, unless he has something to hide...
     
    Socks likes this.
  6. Socks Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092
    Thanks padders,

    I must admit to not getting the effort made to post pictures of MWO extracts possibly inferring a reason for the conflict between ref & serial but not mentioning anything about it in the description. Even a person unfamiliar with watches would look at the description and think a 74 reference points to a production year, and anybody spending £5,000 would have half an idea what they are looking for anyway...
     
  7. abrod520 Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    11,218
    Likes
    35,254
    This is a 27m movement, it's wayyy out of range for a -74. In fact it's too early for any Speedmaster Professional save the 145.022-68. Given the rest of the watch lines up with the features of a -74, I'd say it's a movement swap from a cheaper Seamaster chrono
     
    Davidt likes this.
  8. Toishome Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    1,991
    Likes
    9,524
    The link doesn't work ::confused2::
     
  9. padders Oooo subtitles! Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    8,931
    Likes
    13,873
    Did you read the MWO extract above? It states that -74s have been found with earlier steel brake movements. I agree that on face value the number is too low and should be more usually seen in a 1969 produced watch, but as I say there have been multiple examples of -74s with incongruous numbers which still check out on an extract even though the serial suggests otherwise. The fact the seller hasn't got the extract though and is depending on waffle suggests this may not be one of them. On balance I agree it is dodgy, but the 27m is not necessarily the smoking gun many may assume for a -74 IMO.
     
    Socks likes this.
  10. bimmernerd Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    95
    Likes
    122
    The link doesn't work for me either. What was their asking price?
     
  11. abrod520 Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    11,218
    Likes
    35,254
    Steel brakes can be found in 861s as high as the 31ms, which is a large batch that was installed in watches for years and is commonly found in -74s. The steel brake isn't the factor I'm focusing on - the movement is too early even for a 145.022-69, much less a -71 or -74.
     
    Davidt likes this.
  12. padders Oooo subtitles! Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    8,931
    Likes
    13,873
    Fair enough, I can't claim particular expertise on the early 1970s models, was just passing on the fact that serials get screwy with the -74s, more so on than on other iterations. I do take you point that this would be an extreme case and Occam's Razor suggests Franken monkey business is the most likely explanation.
     
  13. abrod520 Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    11,218
    Likes
    35,254
    This is true, though they generally have 31m or 39m serials. I think the reason for this is that Omega expected a large demand for the Speedmaster after the moon landing (Straight Writings tend to have 30m or 31m serials) and produced a huge lot of 861s while their production process was in the 31ms. Automatic chronographs and then quartz technology superseded manual wind in the popular imagination during this period though so there were probably more of those movements left over into 1975 than Omega had originally expected
     
    Socks and padders like this.
  14. Socks Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092
    Edited Sep 11, 2019
  15. Socks Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092
  16. Socks Sep 11, 2019

    Posts
    545
    Likes
    1,092