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Customizing watch movements for enhanced performance, not aesthetics...

  1. M'Bob Feb 12, 2019

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    We've all seen those beautiful movements from the upper-tier watch companies, with the chamfered edges, Geneva stripes, etc. Typically, if you ask a watchmaker about it, their response is, "Looks great, has no real effect on the watch's performance."

    So my question is, just like customizing a car, has anyone heard of (other than the timing competitions of yore), watchmakers swapping out a better balance, a wheel here or there or other upgrades to a stock watch movement with the sole intent of improved performance, reliability, or robustness? The closest I've gotten was have a guy jewel something that originally had a bushing.
     
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  2. S.H. Feb 12, 2019

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    Speaking only for vintage, I think Rolex tweaked their valjoux ebauches in the Daytona. Girard-perregaux was also known to modify (themselves? was it done by eta?) their eta base movements.
     
  3. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Feb 12, 2019

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    Interesting comparison of 2 variations of the same lemania precursor. It speaks to the technical changes to make it better, as well as the finishing which surprisingly is secondary to the differences.

    Note he makes an error in regards to the Patek column wheel. Can you spot it?
     
    Edited Feb 12, 2019
  4. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Feb 12, 2019

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    Ok hint. It’s not cappedbecause Patek is hiding it. There is a reason it’s capped. Does anyone know?
     
  5. IanS Feb 12, 2019

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    IWC used to modify ETA calibers for tolerance and timekeeping.
     
  6. Professor Feb 13, 2019

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    My Raketa is a very old model that apparently was a French sub second movement design bought and altered by the Russians to a central second.
    The bridge that holds the parts for the second hand has the look of an add on. The plate sits high above the rest of the movement requiring a deep pie pan type case back that looks more suited to a self winder.

    My Benrus tonneau uses a otherwise common movement of the day that was altered by Benrus to add their proprietary flat spring loaded balance shaft bearings.

    My Shanghai Watch Factory ZSH has a movement that was altered and improved throughout its production life from 1958 onward and is still manufactured today.
    Probably the same can be said for most popular movements.

    Just watched the British mini series "Longitude". Its amazing how many alterations were made to all of Harrison's time pieces before he got them near where he wanted them, but he was never really satisfied even then.
    At some point alterations to improve function are not enough and the watch maker just has to start with a clean slate.

    I think you are more interested in movements improved by individual watch makers. Perhaps a better alloy main spring or addition of an Iron shield to avoid effects of magnetic fields. A less fragile balance shaft perhaps.

    If the parts aren't available through spares from other brands they would have to be made by the watch maker himself. I've seen a number of highly specialized tools for making parts no longer available so I would guess that a master of the craft could do whatever was asked within reason.
     
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  7. STANDY schizophrenic pizza orderer and watch collector Feb 13, 2019

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    Larger balance spring for longer power reserve
     
  8. marco Feb 13, 2019

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    I suspect it is capped to keep the chrono levers in place in the event of a hard knock or jolt ?
    I can't think why they would want to obscure the beautyful column wheel otherwise.
     
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  9. JimInOz Melbourne Australia Feb 13, 2019

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    balance spring?

    maxwell-smart.gif

    ;)
     
  10. redzer007 Feb 13, 2019

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    Is the OP asking about (to continue the car analogy) a tuning house, such as AMG (old version) taking a mercedes an modifying it, or are we taking about, taking you own stock car and modify the parts to improve performance.

    If it's the latter IM not sure I have heard of any one doing that. If it were possible I'd love to read the Speedmaster engine mod threads on OF.

    If it's the former I guess loads of companies do it. any company who takes a standard ETA movements and modifies it for performance would tick this box. (Eg Omega 1120 in SMP)

    I really hope it's the latter, if so I'm in!!!
     
  11. marco Feb 13, 2019

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    I did read somewhere that a watchmaker in the UK modded the 12 hour register on the 321 movement by putting a jewell from a Seiko under the pivot instead of the plain bearing.
    Unfortuanately I cannot find reference to this to the point of wondering where the hell I read it !
     
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  12. Willbur Feb 13, 2019

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    If you want to replace parts, you have to look for balance and hairspring with improved behavior regarding thermal variation and magnetism.
    For example, the ETA2824 is sold with different finishing and the highest level have a specific balance as far as I remember.

    After that it's will be tuned by adjusting parts as pallet angle, wheel axes polishing and maybe selecting a part from the same reference but a little bit different due to manufacturing tolerance. Everything should match perfectly.
    And of course, to have the best result in any position.

    This is usually what is done when a watch have to be prepare for competition,by top level watchmaker.
     
  13. STANDY schizophrenic pizza orderer and watch collector Feb 13, 2019

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    Better balance maybe :whistling:

    Not even going to edit it, hot up here today 441961B8-84F5-4B77-92C8-9E4B389EAF2D.gif
     
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  14. JimInOz Melbourne Australia Feb 13, 2019

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    No sweat mate. Have a coldie for me.
     
  15. Deafboy His Holiness Puer Surdus Feb 13, 2019

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    Didn't Ball pocket watches use Hamilton movements and modify them for improved performance? Calling @Canuck, @Fritz.
     
  16. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Feb 13, 2019

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    It is to strengthen the column wheel. Not for a jolt exactly but the uncapped column wheel is a weak point as a column can break off. This is actually a requirement for Geneva seal watches, hence Patek has no choice but to cap it.
     
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  17. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Feb 13, 2019

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    Are you referring to mods made by a brand, or some improvement made by an individual watchmaker to just one watch during service?
     
  18. BlackTalon This Space for Rent Feb 13, 2019

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    I cross-drilled the mainspring in my '67 Speedy to lighten it up some. Now it runs much faster :cool:

    Unfortunately the power reserve decreased. By a lot... :mad:



    ::rimshot::
     
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  19. M'Bob Feb 13, 2019

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    The latter. For instance: have you ever had a particular movement apart, saw something original that you didn't care for in the movement design, and then made a modification to improve some aspect of function- timekeeping, durability, etc.?
     
  20. M'Bob Feb 13, 2019

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    Yes, exactly what I was driving at, and wondered if our esteemed forum watchmakers ever see things in the popular, common movements that makes them go, hmmm, with a little change here, this thing would be very much improved.
     
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