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noelekal
··Home For Wayward WatchesCanuck, you bring it to life.
Calling all Pocket Watch Buffs
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WestCoastTime
·3/4 plate E Howard, Gr 4, c.1885. For sale at auction (not by me).
Interesting to see the regulator arm on the balance cock as normal, but then with the hairspring stud carrier fixed to the main plate.
Exceedingly fancy diamond set case work
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Interesting to see the regulator arm on the balance cock as normal, but then with the hairspring stud carrier fixed to the main plate.
Exceedingly fancy diamond set case work
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Canuck
·Ooooooh! Nice!
In his book on the E Howard & Co. watches, Colonel Townsend lists this “N” size Howard S# 201265 as being a VII th model. This was not a designation given by Edward Howard. E Howard watches were almost entirely individually produced by one workman. Howard made no secret of the fact that interchangeability of parts was not his priority. There are differences from model to model which are obviously different. I have shown a picture of my (only) E Howard watch (S# 219761) which is also an N size, VII th model. The pinning point for the hairspring stud is on the balance cock, not a separate “bib” attached to the bridge over the train wheels. Howard had a system of designating the grade of his movements. The “hound” grade had a hound engraved on the train bridge, and it was “unadjusted”. Next was the”horse” grade which was adjusted for heat and cold. Then there was the “stag” grade which was adjusted to heat, cold, and 6 positions. The hound, horse, or stag was usually engraved on the bridge over the train wheels. The watch posted by @WestCoastTime doesn’t have the grade designated on the movement. Notice on the image of my E Howard, the “stag” (denoting the highest grade) is engraved on the plates. Notice the subject watch doesn’t have the grade designation marked, but it is engraved Heat & Cold which indicates to me that it must be a “horse” (mid range) grade of movement. My “stag” grade example is marked adjusted. Interesting differences from watch to watch was common with E Howard watches. Beautiful four colour gold (likely karat gold) case!
In his book on the E Howard & Co. watches, Colonel Townsend lists this “N” size Howard S# 201265 as being a VII th model. This was not a designation given by Edward Howard. E Howard watches were almost entirely individually produced by one workman. Howard made no secret of the fact that interchangeability of parts was not his priority. There are differences from model to model which are obviously different. I have shown a picture of my (only) E Howard watch (S# 219761) which is also an N size, VII th model. The pinning point for the hairspring stud is on the balance cock, not a separate “bib” attached to the bridge over the train wheels. Howard had a system of designating the grade of his movements. The “hound” grade had a hound engraved on the train bridge, and it was “unadjusted”. Next was the”horse” grade which was adjusted for heat and cold. Then there was the “stag” grade which was adjusted to heat, cold, and 6 positions. The hound, horse, or stag was usually engraved on the bridge over the train wheels. The watch posted by @WestCoastTime doesn’t have the grade designated on the movement. Notice on the image of my E Howard, the “stag” (denoting the highest grade) is engraved on the plates. Notice the subject watch doesn’t have the grade designation marked, but it is engraved Heat & Cold which indicates to me that it must be a “horse” (mid range) grade of movement. My “stag” grade example is marked adjusted. Interesting differences from watch to watch was common with E Howard watches. Beautiful four colour gold (likely karat gold) case!
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WestCoastTime
·Ooooooh! Nice!
In his book on the E Howard & Co. watches, Colonel Townsend lists this “N” size Howard S# 201265 as being a VII th model. This was not a designation given by Edward Howard. E Howard watches were almost entirely individually produced by one workman. Howard made no secret of the fact that interchangeability of parts was not his priority. There are differences from model to model which are obviously different. I have shown a picture of my (only) E Howard watch (S# 219761) which is also an N size, VII th model. The pinning point for the hairspring stud is on the balance cock, not a separate “bib” attached to the bridge over the train wheels. Howard had a system of designating the grade of his movements. The “hound” grade had a hound engraved on the train bridge, and it was “unadjusted”. Next was the”horse” grade which was adjusted for heat and cold. Then there was the “stag” grade which was adjusted to heat, cold, and 6 positions. The hound, horse, or stag was usually engraved on the bridge over the train wheels. The watch posted by @WestCoastTime doesn’t have the grade designated on the movement. Notice on the image of my E Howard, the “stag” (denoting the highest grade) is engraved on the plates. Notice the subject watch doesn’t have the grade designation marked, but it is engraved Heat & Cold which indicates to me that it must be a “horse” (mid range) grade of movement. My “stag” grade example is marked adjusted. Interesting differences from watch to watch was common with E Howard watches. Beautiful four colour gold (likely karat gold) case!
Do you know how one would let the power down on this type of movement? I'm assuming there is something like a conventional click under the main bridge, but not seeing any access to the click or to any kind of actuator.
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Canuck
·Do you know how one would let the power down on this type of movement? I'm assuming there is something like a conventional click under the main bridge, but not seeing any access to the click or to any kind of actuator.
The two Howards in this thread don’t show a crown wheel and ratchet wheel on the top plate. Thereby, they use a rocker-bar system behind the dial. The stop click and the ratchet wheel are also behind the dial. Many American watches that use this rocker-bar system have a radial hole drilled through the edge of the pillar plate. Letting the power down requires the movement to be out of the case. Use a bench key to back up the recoil click, then insert a pin into the radial hole to contact the tail of the click, then the bench key allows you to release the power. Not all Howards are like these two.
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Canuck
·Further to your question @WestCoastTime , this image shows a typical rocker-bar winding and setting set up behind the dial of an 18-size Hamilton. The recoil click is located at about the 9:00 position. In the case of the movement shown, the tail of the recoil click can be seen through an access window in the edge of the pillar plate.
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Canuck
·Last re-set and minor regulation of my 138 year old Waltham 1877 model hunter cased pocket watch was five days ago. As of Saturday morning, it is about 2 seconds slow! And it is not railroad grade, or railroad approved. Remarkable to my way of thinking!
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Fritz
·Elgin 156... this movement cost $100 wholesale in 1905, without a case. So top of the line then.
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Canuck
·Ooooooh! Exquisite!
From the pocketwatchdatabase. With a production date circa 1904, the database listing shows this hunter cased movement to be railroad grade. Railroad grade, but railroad approved? Different railroads interpreted generally accepted time service rules as to what they permitted on their own railroads, so this one might have been railroad approved, somewhere. It has my approval! Please tell us more about the case.
https://pocketwatchdatabase.com/search/result/elgin/10249350
From Wikipedia.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/C.D._Peacock
The data base classes this a “Class F”. The definition of class F.
From the pocketwatchdatabase. With a production date circa 1904, the database listing shows this hunter cased movement to be railroad grade. Railroad grade, but railroad approved? Different railroads interpreted generally accepted time service rules as to what they permitted on their own railroads, so this one might have been railroad approved, somewhere. It has my approval! Please tell us more about the case.
https://pocketwatchdatabase.com/search/result/elgin/10249350
From Wikipedia.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/C.D._Peacock
The data base classes this a “Class F”. The definition of class F.
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Fritz
·As C.D.Peacock styled themselves more as a high end jeweller I doubt this was sold to anybody who ever stepped on the deckplate of a steam engine. With a very expensive movement in a solid 14k huntercase, this was likely somebody’s dress watch and likely their pride and joy.
I’ll bet he drove a Packard.
I’ll bet he drove a Packard.
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Canuck
·As C.D.Peacock styled themselves more as a high end jeweller I doubt this was sold to anybody who ever stepped on the deckplate of a steam engine. With a very expensive movement in a solid 14k huntercase, this was likely somebody’s dress watch and likely their pride and joy.
I’ll bet he drove a Packard.
I’m sure you are right. Classed as railroad grade F.
Definition:
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ghce
·As C.D.Peacock styled themselves more as a high end jeweller I doubt this was sold to anybody who ever stepped on the deckplate of a steam engine. With a very expensive movement in a solid 14k huntercase, this was likely somebody’s dress watch and likely their pride and joy.
I’ll bet he drove a Packard.
If he paid that much for it in 1905 I feel quite sure he was chauffeured in a Packard! That sort of cash would likely buy a house,
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Canuck
·Seventh day since last re-set. My 1877 model, 18-size Waltham, made circa 1885. Not railroad grade nor railroad approved, but dead on! Truth to tell, in seven days, it had been 2 seconds slow at one point, and 4 seconds fast at another. But this watch rivals the very best of my railroad approved models. (And the guy I bought it from wasn’t interested in paying for the repairs it needed! I am eternally grateful for people like him!)
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Fritz
·I totally agree! A highlight piece, for sure. If. Was to stumble onto such a treasure, I think I would quit collecting. I wouldn’t be able to aim any higher.
Frau Fritz was mildly annoyed at the loss of our first born son until I offered to make his bedroom into a sewing room, that, and having to mow the lawn myself now have made this a relatively inexpensive purchase.
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Canuck
·Her: No more watches!
Him: You’re talking like my ex-wife!
Her: You didn’t tell me you’d been married before!
Him: I wasn’t!
Him: You’re talking like my ex-wife!
Her: You didn’t tell me you’d been married before!
Him: I wasn’t!
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Fritz
·There are certain watches, poor homeless types, that are kept in a shallow bowl on top of the dresser along with my wedding band and a few other pieces of personal stuff when I’m not wearing them. Its lined with a few polishing cloths so that 18s railroad watches don’t resonate down through the woodwork and keep Frau Fritz awake as this has been known to create problems.
I cleaned the bowl out today and was surprised at what was under those rags...
no idea why I have an American two dollar bill, who the little girl is or what that tiny piece of paper money is, I am pleased to have found the French coin though as it is a Marianne and worth somewhat more than the 20 francs its marked as.
I cleaned the bowl out today and was surprised at what was under those rags...
no idea why I have an American two dollar bill, who the little girl is or what that tiny piece of paper money is, I am pleased to have found the French coin though as it is a Marianne and worth somewhat more than the 20 francs its marked as.
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Tire-comedon
·There are certain watches, poor homeless types, that are kept in a shallow bowl on top of the dresser along with my wedding band and a few other pieces of personal stuff when I’m not wearing them. Its lined with a few polishing cloths so that 18s railroad watches don’t resonate down through the woodwork and keep Frau Fritz awake as this has been known to create problems.
I cleaned the bowl out today and was surprised at what was under those rags...
no idea why I have an American two dollar bill, who the little girl is or what that tiny piece of paper money is, I am pleased to have found the French coin though as it is a Marianne and worth somewhat more than the 20 francs its marked as.
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Canuck
·The girl. Clara Bow, maybe?