I posted this earlier on WUS, but thought it might get better response here. I know this has been discussed to the point of death, but I need some advice. I read the several page discussion about this. It was quite interesting until my brain was full.
Anyway, I took in a Cal. 750 in some trade work for a local jeweler. The owner wanted the crystal replaced. Well the crown was loose on the stem and could not be tightened to the point of being reliable. So, I quoted the price of a new crystal, stem and crown back to the jeweler.
The owner went into sticker shock and said all he wanted was a generic crystal. As we know, generic crystals do not fit the case correctly because the tension ring in to Omega crystal is relieved for dial fit. Bottom line is polish the crystal and install a new generic crown that will stay tight on the stem for El Cheapo.
Now that the watch can be wound by the crown, the reversing wheel is noisy and adds resistance to the winding effort. The rotor does NOT move when winding with the stem. I don't know if it came in like this or not. I'm obviously eating this one, but am reluctant to send a watch out with a problem.
So, thoughts and suggestions? Put a couple of drops of D5 between the wheels? Tear the assembly down, clean and lube? This is a damned if you do; damned if you don't situation.
Thanks!

 

Wait a sec - you're masquerading as a watch "fixer", and TAKING PAYMENT from clients, yet you can't fix this watch?

 

I think he said he eating the costs on this one. But I'm curious why you would have to eat the costs. You where just asked to replace the stem and crystal.

Also I'm pretty sure rotors are not supposed to move when you wind on these Omegas.

 

A few questions: What kind of noise and how do you know it adds resistance (compared to what)? The rotor of this movement never moves when winding with the stem - does the mainspring get wound up?

And based on your description of the situation, I'm not sure why you have to eat it up. If you have to then it's not a dammed if you do.

 

Guarantees only apply to the work actually done! Crown stays on, crystal looks better? Job done! He wanted a partial repair done, and a partial repair is what he got. You don't take a car to a garage for a leaky radiator, have them fix it, then return later with a complaint that a rear axle seal is leaking! Maybe lube the reverser, and if that fixes it, let it go at that. Having been in a spot like this myself, you have my sympathies. Cost me two customers when I stood my ground, but that is a decision you'll have to make.

If I am asked for a partial repair and I know more work needs to be done, I send it back with a quote for a complete repair. Either they send it back for a complete repair, or they don't send it back.

 

The rotor moves on a few calibers, most common being the ETA 2824. Even a dumb squirrel knows that!

 

I'm not charging for the reversing wheel problem because it was not in the initial workup at the jeweler's shop. The watch could not be wound with the crown because it was loose. The owner is too cheap to pay for anything related to a genuine Omega part, much less a repair. I get a lot of work from the jeweler and value our relationship. On the other hand, I don't want to send a watch out with a known problem.

Yes, the rotor is not supposed to move when winding with the stem. The reversing wheel is doing its job of decoupling the stem winding from the rotor. However, when you lift the auto winder bridge off the movement and wind the mainspring with the stem, then install the bridge and wind with the stem again there is additional resistance to the winding action with the bridge installed. There is also a ratcheting noise. The satellite pinions in the reversing wheel assembly are not running freely when the stem is doing the winding. They work fine, as one would expect, when using the rotor to wind the mainspring. I can get the same indication holding the bridge in my hand and turning the driving wheel in the same direction as when the mainspring ratchet wheel is driving it.

When it goes back to the jeweler's shop, it will have with it a recommendation for a full service at Omega regardless of what I do to it now. Then the owner will see what the maintenance costs are for a really god watch. I just want it out of here fully functional.

 

From the sound of it, the owner of the watch has never had it serviced. The arbors on the intermediate winding gears and the reverser have been known to wear out on any automatic! If you are unable to improve the action of the winding, I think the jeweller needs a full report on the state of wear of these parts (if the parts ARE worn), and a statement from you that you are not responsible for that wear. The customer is the RETAILER'S problem, not yours!

 

Yep, been doing it for over 50 years. They don't taste any better now than they did back then. You would think they would have caught up with me by now!

 

I think it's good to consider this as a goodwill toward the relationship but just a clean and lube won't fix worn out parts. You can still do that and inform the jeweller about your effort, that you've already done more than what you were asked to do.

 

Thanks Canuck,

That's pretty much where this is headed. There are a couple of service marks inside the case back, but the watch is close to 50 years old. Don't know how recently it was serviced, but from looking at it a full service should be done sooner rather than later. Also don't know the history of the watch or the owner. Time to cut the losses and move on.

 

I think you know what the issue is here and you know these are not the easiest to take apart which is why a lot of people don't seem to bother. It's very possible that if you open up the reversing wheel assembly then it will be full of dirt and old sludgy oil. I have seen some like that and the full assembly is all you can buy, as far as I know. It's not cheap either being a 7 part assembly (about $150 so clearly not for the owner you've described) but, they do respond to a clean and oil in general.

These are a bit different to, say, an ETA reversing wheel as you clearly know. I met someone recently who has the correct Omega tools for opening these and will see him again in a couple of months and try to get him to bring them along so I can see them and make a copy as I'm sure they'll be easier to use than my current method.

Good luck, Chris

 

Had this job come my way, I think I might have fitted the crown and tried the manual winding, without doubt discovering there were other problems. Remove the crown, case it up again, and return it with a quote!

 

Well, I put a small amount of D5 between the two reversing wheels. There was some improvement, but not what one would call great. Anyway, it's going in the case and back to the owner. I'll write a full condition report along with service recommendations. As cheap as this guy is, I hope he sends it somewhere else. He's already looking at close to $300 US in parts cost for crystal, crown and reversing assembly, not knowing what else will be found.

Looking back on it, you have the right idea Canuck

Thanks for all the ideas and suggestions.

 

Hi Watchfixr,

I didn't answer on WUS because you know what the answer is already. You just need to do the work properly rather than look for a quick fix.

Oh, and you said your brain was full after reading some threads here so I didn't want a Mr. Creosote style incident happening with your head by me adding that one thin wafer of extra information...

BTW this is a classic example of why I don't do trade work, or take in anything for a partial repair. No matter if it's related to what you are doing or not, if something goes wrong with the watch after you touch it, your are "it" in the game of "who's to blame" tag.

Cheers, Al