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Buying My First Vintage Omega - Authenticity & Price? Seamaster 166.002

  1. hrobi May 4, 2016

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    Hi all,

    I've been looking around for a while now for my first Omega, and on Ebay I've found a:

    Vintage Omega Seamaster Automatic 166.002, cal 565.

    seamaster2.JPG
    The seller off ebay has 100% positive feedback, from 100+ vintage watch sales (pretty much entirely vintage swiss watches - omega, rolex, iwc - and seikos), 43 sales within the last 12 months.

    I had a few questions that I hoped this forum community might be able to shed light on!
    1. Based off the images below, I was wondering what people's thoughts were on it's authenticity? And if authentic, how much would you pay for it? (USD$)

    2. To my understanding there should be a serial number on the movement, but it looks like it could potentially be blocked in view? I should ask to see a photo of it?

    3. The casing and dial and overall watch seems in extremely good condition (brand new even)... The seller mentioned that the watch was 'recently overhauled', which is a statement used in all of his other watch sales. I assume this means a lot of the outward facing elements have been replaced/repaired, because it looks in far too condition to be decades old (unless a reproduction?). Only the internal movement obviously hints towards age.

    - Also, I've asked the seller if papers/box exist, and I'm waiting on a response but I assume they don't (otherwise a photo or text mentioning would've been added). I also realise that papers and boxes can also be faked and are no guarantee anyway.

    Overall, it seems like a fantastic watch (if genuine). I particularly like the black dial, which I think gives it an edgier feel than the typical off-white dials that seem to be found in seamasters from this era (I am the furthest thing from an Omega expert though).

    Let me know what you think! All photos are of the actual watch (according to the seller)

    seamaster2.JPG $_57 (2).JPG $_57 (3).JPG $_57 (4).JPG $_57 (5).JPG $_57 (6).JPG seamaster1.JPG
     
    seamaster2.JPG
  2. sky21 May 4, 2016

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    Initial thoughts are; definitely ask to see a pic of the movement serial number, and the term "recently overhauled" is too vague to mean anything specific. Ask him exactly what that means, especially if he uses it in all of his listings. It looks very clean for an old watch and hopefully some Seamaster experts on here will chime in to help you out. Good luck with your potential purchase.
     
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  3. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    Thanks for the quick response, yep definitely am asking for clarification on those issues you mentioned... Surely the case must have been replaced if it's genuinely from 1966
     
  4. ConElPueblo May 5, 2016

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    The case is quite polished and the movement looks horrible. I'm guessing that it's from India? Looks like one of those listings...
    These sellers often have very high feedback scores, but they don't cater to collectors.
     
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  5. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    True, it looks extremely polished.

    I'm not sure how much of a difference having the serial number does or doesn't make?

    I just assumed after 5 years of selling $3k+ 'vintage' rolexes and IWCs, there would be some outcry if they turned out to be fakes.

    I'm not familiar at all with omega watches, but surely if you don't replace a lot of the internal parts for a few decades, only re-oiling, they will rust? What specifically about the movement looks horrible to you?
     
  6. ConElPueblo May 5, 2016

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    Compared to some of the specimens you see, I wouldn't call it extremely polished. But take a look at the case back, do a picture search online and compare - you'll see that definition has been lost through polishing.

    It's pretty rare that Omegas (especially of this, very common variant!) are faked. It's more a case of them having been put together by different, often broken, watches. Often they'll be redialed as well, which I guess this one is - if it's from India, I just pass.

    There is nothing unusual with having a perfectly original movement that is 60-70 years old without having anything but wear and tear items replaced. If the watch has been regularly serviced or just sparingly used, that is.

    Compare the finish between these two and tell me what the difference is:


    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]

    ..?
     
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  7. efauser I ♥ karma!!! May 5, 2016

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    I'm guessing it's from South Korea. Looks like a typical eBay listing photo from one of the SK redialers.
     
  8. ChrisN May 5, 2016

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    It's not a good buy in my opinion either but (and I am only looking on my phone) is it a redial?

    Here's mine:
    dial post cleaning.jpg
    Cheers, Chris
     
  9. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    Yeah haha I actually just got the exact same photo up through google image search after reading your first comment, and was comparing the two as well. From what I can tell, there's clearly a difference in the metal quality or at the very least the coating - all over but particularly the 'omega' logo which is very worn out on a part of the watch that really shouldn't be rubbing against anything at all (in my mind).

    The seller is listed from as from the UK but with further investigation I believe is from South Korea.

    All in all I like the front-end aesthetics, but yeah I agree that it 99.99% chance is a South Korean (or Indian) redial, so I should probably factor that into the price I'm willing to pay
     
  10. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    Thanks for the feedback, yeah I think overall it's almost certainly a redial, and given (just visually) the flimsy quality of the movement, this'll all factor into the price I'm willing to pay (Very little) if I just want it for the aesthetic haha.

    Any suggestions on a good source of original vintage omega seamasters?
     
  11. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    Ps that dial looks fantastic
     
  12. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    Good pick up, with further investigation the seller is South Korean!

    Any recommendations on a good location (website) for original vintage seamasters/rough price you would pay? For example, say the above watch if it was in decent condition and original?
     
  13. Tiny Iota Could potentially be the Official OF Stalker ™ May 5, 2016

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    Saw a guy on the Tube this week with a vintage Seamaster where the dial was bright purple. I doubt he could care less because it matched his shirt.
     
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  14. ConElPueblo May 5, 2016

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    I'm a member of a Facebook user group for vintage watches where one of the members just asked for advice on where he could find a yellow dialed "cannabis leaf" Omega ::facepalm2::
     
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  15. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    haha is the watch set to 4.20 permanently? ;)

    also, where would you recommend looking for a vintage seamaster or geneve within the $1k range? (give or take) currently I'm looking at chrono24.

    thanks for the advice before as well, much appreciated!
     
  16. ConElPueblo May 5, 2016

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    If you don't know much about vintage watches (so unable to decipher whether a given watch is "worth it" or not), I cannot think of any place that is better than here. Honestly.

    https://omegaforums.net/forums/private-watch-sales/

    This is a good example: https://omegaforums.net/threads/seamaster-cal-1002-167-027-£595-fully-serviced.39417/

    But before you dive into this, I think you'd better make up what you really want.

    - Brand.
    - Age/era.
    - Style.
    - Material.
    - Size.
    - How much you're going to wear it.
    - How long time you intend to own it.

    With vintage watches, as in many other fields, you have two parameters you can set: Time & Money.

    Do you want to take the Time necessary to learn about the subject and be able to make a qualified assesment and strike a good deal? Or do you want to spend your time doing other stuff and pay a premium for a watch that'll meet your requirements?

    EDIT: forgot to add: for $1K you can easily find a perfectly servicable Omega in fine condition that'll outlast you by a wide margin.
     
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  17. efauser I ♥ karma!!! May 5, 2016

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    I recommend watching https://omegaforums.net/forums/private-watch-sales/ They come up from time to time or, set a search on WatchRecon. Regardless of the location, when you find one you like, post it here. You'll find out if it's a keeper or not.
     
  18. hrobi May 5, 2016

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    definitely, thanks!
     
  19. Tiny Iota Could potentially be the Official OF Stalker ™ May 5, 2016

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    And I'll say this as it consistently seems to confuse newcomers, you do not need 200 posts to buy. You won't be able to post replies in sales sections but you can PM the seller by clicking on their avatar and choosing send message. I bought before having 200 and I really think it's the best way to get quality.
     
  20. ChrisN May 5, 2016

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    Sorry, I wasn't clear but, allowing for the fact I'm looking on my phone, I don't think your one is a redial. It looks very similar to mine. Only saying this so you gain knowledge. If you're used to modern watches, these 166.002 models are a good buy as they seen big on the wrist.

    I would say the guys advice about looking here is the best option and forget the other.

    Cheers, Chris