Hello,

This is my first post on Omegaforums and I would like to share my recent acquisition with the rest of the community here. This forum, Speedmaster101.com and Moonwatch Only have been invaluable to me as I try to learn about the murky world of vintage watch collecting, and specifically Omega Speedmasters.

I bought the watch online from a Swiss dealer and paid CHF 8500. According to him, the bezel, dial and hands are all original and that the watch has been serviced.

Some concerns I have about the watch:

1. Caseback is from a -65 but serial no. 24530XXX does not fall within the range highlighted on Speedmaster101 or MWO. Possibly a -66 with HF case but with a -65 caseback?

2. Both pushers are 5mm wide but their heights are different. The start/stop pusher is 2.6mm tall and has a more rounded top while the reset pusher is 2.4mm tall and has a flatter top. Do they look like the right pushers for the reference?

3. With regard to the hands, my untrained eyes are not able to tell if they look right.

4. Seconds subdial has some damage from the hand not being set correctly. Some of the lume on the hour markers have fallen off.

5. Bracelet is a 7912 but the clasp cover is from a 1039/1506? I'm using an Omega Nato strap instead of the bracelet.

6. Watch and chronograph runs but it gains approximately 20s in 24 hours. Having said that, I have been wearing it every weekend since receiving it on October 22nd. It probably needs a service?


I do not have a good camera so I hope the photos will be sufficient to pick out some of the details. Well, here are the photos of my very first vintage watch purchase:

All comments/opinions are most welcome!

 

Indeed the serial is not in the range for a -65 but it's very close, so I think it could be ok.
The shape of the case, with very thick lugs, is typical of the 105012-65 HF. The dial is ok too.

 

The Extract doesn't specify whether it's a -65 or -66 though. However, I agree that because it's a January 1967 production, it was probably among the very last -65s produced; I think it's in good shape. I'm no pusher expert but they look OK to me too.

Either way, you have a very cool watch there

 

Serial looks good for a -65 HF, my 105.012-65 has also a 24530XXX serial and was produced on December 5, 1966

 

A dealers watch....

 

To be more helpful, I have a 105.012-65 from Chile that I believe to be original movement / Case with a 24530xxx

 

Thank you everyone for your replies so far!

Spacefruit, I've learnt a lot from your insights on other threads. What do you mean by "a dealer's watch"?

I'm new to collecting and went for this piece because I've been looking for a decent 105.012 for quite some time. Despite the questionable serial number and the "franken" bracelet, I did not want to miss out on what I thought was a mostly original piece.

Your watch from Chile looks fantastic! I was mildly surprised to find out from the Extract that my watch was delivered to Lebanon.

 

Dealers watches often raise questions, that call into doubt the originality, and are often answered by the community thus: "well it may be ok, BUT..."

This is a great watch to wear, and as such I value it. There are one or two niggles that bother me. Funnily enough the serial does not, but I do wonder if the case is original to the watch - but hey, we cannot prove that one bit, so we have to move on.

The dial is damaged, the hands need investigation, but in the photos I see they look very white. The bezel is not great, and looks as though it has spent time off of a watch, and I would bet it was added to replace either a good bezel for use elsewhere or a service bezel.

The pusher issue is strange - if you really do have two different spec pushers, and I cannot quite see that you do, then that would indicate a sub - specification service. Why replace only one pusher? (to save money....aka dealers watch again)

The movement is showing signs of substantial work by poor technicians. Check the screw heads all of which show damage and the general state of the movement which does not look clean. It has been serviced cheaply. (Like a dealer would, to save money)

Absolutely inexcusable to sell a watch as serviced and have it look and perform like this.

Back to this watch. It is not bad, and the price was not bad.

Dont panic. It needs some TLC but all is not lost, if you have access to an Omega Watchmaker.

If this were my watch, I would investigate the hands, check they are vintage tritium. Have the watch serviced, and instruct that all damaged movement screws be replaced.
Check the pushers and see if they are matching Omega pushers - replace if they are two different ones.
Remove and clean the bezel - it might improve.

Of course I recommend STS - they have done wonders for me

 

Yes, I was trying not to panic as I read the first half of your reply. But all extremely valid points!

The hands are rather white and have very slight wear only. I exposed the dial to a torch for about 10s and then switched off the lights in my room. The hands and hour markers glowed faintly for a few seconds before fading. They don't glow at all in any other instance.

The bezel needs work as you said but it's strangely appealing to me. Maybe because it looks so worn. There was quite a bit of dirt trapped between the bezel and the crystal which I picked out with a toothpick.

The pushers did make me wonder initially, if one had more wear than the other. Although they are within the 3mm height spec for this reference, they feel different to the touch and you can see the very slight height difference upon close inspection. Your explanation seems much more plausible.

I used a loupe to inspect the movement more closely and you are absolutely right about the state of it. Nearly every screw head has some damage to it and there are messy applications of lubricant clearly evident. Screwdrivers with incorrectly sized heads were probably used.

I was rather disappointed by the whole purchasing experience as the dealer was initially very evasive, claiming that my emails were delivered to his junk mailbox. In my haste, I didn't ask for clearer photos and simply paid the asking price. After I received the watch and highlighted it's poor accuracy, I didn't hear back from him either. Well, lesson learned.

I will reach out to STS and see what can be done to correct the issues based on your advice.

Glad to be a part of this amazing community!

 

This watch will come out fine.
Actually STS can work some magic sometimes with pushers, reusing them but dismantling and cleaning them. they will still be discolored in the tube...but I like that and you will retain the curved heads of the originals.

I am happy to hear the bezel is as I suspected, dirty. It may get even better.

It is Simon at STS you need. Call him. He knows what to do. Tell him you want your watch "Like William has them"

He will know just what to do!

 

All in all a learning, quite expensive though but you can be glad to own this one with fixable issues.

 

Great analysis. I am looking forward to see the transformation after the service. Where would you recommend for a similar service in the United States?

 

As the saying goes - the devil is in the details. yes it is a great analysis indeed.

I have a very poor visual or cursory reading background on all speedy models despite
owning a cb66 and a 67 speedys for years back. but generally I see no serious fault on
this watch either, after surviving years of hard labor.

 

Do enjoy reading people critique on here, my nooby eyes only see a lovely watch. thanks for sharing.

 

Unfortunately i don't know anyone in the USA who can do the same thing as STS on a cal 321. They have parts, and skills (spread over several people and tools), that I have yet to find in any other wortkshop. I have tried and I am open to others but so far, no one.

 

STS is Swiss Time Services, correct? Would you recommend them even for an international customer (also in USA)? I know they probably charge quite a premium but the last thing I want to do is ruin a vintage Speedy with a subpar service.

 

Here is a Comparison: I only have the one watch, but my Dad bought it more than 45 years ago so I know it hasn't been messed with too much. I've been informed by the splendid chaps on this forum that it's a mid 60's 105.012. Apart from the strap and crown... I think it's mostly original???

I plan to take mine over to Simon at ST'S. It would seem, (for the UK) He's the main man!

If you look on my original Nonuffinkbloke posts I have posted quite a few photos of my 105.012.
Cheers!

 

Here's a couple for easy comparison.

 

Gorgeous dial! Though your bezel appears to be a little misaligned