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Amer Sibai sold me incorrect/fake hands

  1. Ninja2789

    Ninja2789 Mar 12, 2018

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    Since many member of OF frequent WatchRecon, I wanted to go ahead and write about a frequent poster on Chronocentric as a warning.

    I'm actually saddened to post this because Amer Sibai (IG: @rare_watches) is a very active member on ChronoTrader throughout the years and has sold numerous watches with great feedback. It was with this background that I bought what I thought was a set of authentic Camaro hands with confidence that I was buying the seller.

    However, I was informed recently the hands were too long and would not clear the chrono-sweep. I looked through Camaro variants on the OntheDash site and saw that no Camaro variants had hands that extend past the tachymeter. In short, Amer sold me either the wrong hands or fake hands. Pictures are below:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    Now, in full disclosure I purchased the hands in Nov 2017 and didn't find out about the hands until late Feb 2018. I understood that it had been a long time since I had purchased the hands since it took my watch-maker a couple months to source the chronosweep and service the watch. I had also requested a refund on a separate matter concerning the subdial hands, which were sold as non-UV reactive but this was not true. As a result, one of the chronosweeps we had sourced became useless, but I was luckily able to find another one in short time.

    However, I felt confident that Amer would rectify this situation given these were obviously not the correct hands that was the basis of the initial sale. Instead, I was told that it had been too long since our transaction. That I had passed up the opportunity to refund it the first time. Then I was told he couldn't give me a refund, but that he could offer me "some Heuer hands so I could sell them and I could save my money". This seemed strange to say the least given I was already having issues with the hands he sold me.

    In short, I wanted to share my experience as a lesson that even with established sellers, it pays to do your due diligence and not be complacent. I'm reminded of the recent scam involving a hacked OF account and realize I got pretty lucky here. I still have a great project watch and it was "only" a couple hundred dollars.

    Still, it's a small group and it's kind of a bummer to feel that you can't trust even some of the most established members in the vintage community.

    Now if anyone has a REAL pair of Heuer Camaro hands for an Exotic 73343 NT, let me know.
     
    Edited Mar 12, 2018
  2. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 13, 2018

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    You aren't the first...welcome to the club.
    Amer is a fraud and scum bag.

    Did you post this on OTD?
     
  3. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 13, 2018

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    Is Amer on this Forum? I would love a public response...unfortunately in addition to being a liar, he is a coward.
     
  4. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 13, 2018

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    He has ripped off several people with the same game. Advertise parts that look similar to the real deal and hope nobody notices.
    Unfortunately most people dont...here is a group of very expensive parts he sold me for a Heuer Autavia Rindt.
    1st Image is from Amer's listing, which you can find here:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/chronotrader/index.cgi?md=read;id=74356

    The hands are not correct for a Rindt.
    The hands are not NOS
    The crystal is the wrong size for any Autavia or Carrera
    The crown is not original to the Autavia Rindt

    When I pointed this out to Amer his reply was:
    “Very strange to heard this… the parts that I send it for you was mounted on a Autavia Rindt !!!!!!!”

    “I offer only parts that I‘m sure they are mounted on a watch , Heuer used not always for 1 reference the same parts and if you search google under Heuer Autavia Rindt you will notice how many different hands are mounted for the Rindt , those parts that you bought from me was mounted on my Rindt that I serviced on tag Heuer and received the old parts .”

    So Amer, are these NOS as advertised or were the parts replaced during service?
    Amer stopped responding to my emails and refused to accept a return.
     
    dsc_0610.jpg hands.jpg L1000662_2.jpg MVC_004S.jpg Chrono_sweepsm.jpg
  5. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 14, 2018

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    Here is another example of Amer Sibai's deception. He sold several Heuer Autavia Crowns here:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/chronotrader/index.cgi?md=read;id=78238

    $650 each for a "original New Old stock Heuer Autavia 2446 screw Back crown the real crown for the second and theird Executions Heuer Autavia 2446"

    This crown is
    absolutely not an "original" NOS Rindt Crown, and absolutely not worth $650.
    You can find the exact same crown on Ebay for $100. It does fit a Heuer Autavia 3rd Execution "Rindt", and is actually close in size to the original...but close only counts in horseshoes. It is not the exact same size as the original and is most certainly not "original New Old stock" for a Rindt.

    Amer Sibai (IG: @rare_watches) you are a fraud and a liar.


     
  6. Amer

    Amer Mar 15, 2018

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    first of All please don`t judge my English is not my mother Language thanks...so lets show all the first lier who whant hurt my reputation, the seller Mr.X Alias Ninja who posted his claim here bought from me 6 months ago Heuer Camaro Hands and after 2 Months he claim that the orange Hands match not the sweep hands ,I ask him to send me Back the hands and I will make Full refund,after 3 weeks he change mind and he want keep the hands and never told me he received a damage Min.hand as you can see on the photos the tritium are loose and he never metioned that he received from me damaged hand!!!!!! I ask him why you don`t claim that?????and now 3 months later wrote me on Instagram ask for refund that the hands are fake!!!!!!! I just propose him for free 3 Heuer set Hands and He can sell them and make 1000 USD and can keep the others hands for Free,but he ask for 300 USD Back and after some chat with him explain him why now after so many long time told me please 200USD Back and is ok otherwise I will claim you public.so if I`m a lier and thief as Mr.Y(Cajuntiger) tried to do that on chronotrader and everywhere and now he have someone who is like him tried to get his money Back after long time ...so I don`t understand how we can do Business with people buying soemthing and want long life Guarantee...........
    if I buy something from someone is my problem to control everything and if their any prolem with stuff that I bought I will claim immediately and not after 6 months.
    Mr.Y(CajunTiger) bougfht from me as you can see a Rindt Bezel,crown ,Hands and crystal and he come after 6 Months to tell me ohhhhhhhh something wrong Here, and he he asking me he want return everything because he noticed perhaps he paid too much and I told him why everything you can return me the hands ....... But the problem is I offer this stuff with XXL photos and if I`m a Buyer I most make my home work correctly and not after 6 Month`s you ask me to return all the stuff.........
    and about Heuer crown for 650 swiss francs that I sell them on Ebay why you mean are not correct!!!!!!!¨now your are a specialist on Heuer parts????or you tried to Told everybody I`m a thief!!!!!!!!!if you are not Happy with my prices why you should Buy from me a crown for 650 swiss francs if someone else sell them for 100!!!!!!!
    so Mr.X Ninja 2789 and Mr.Y Cajuntiger learn firstly How you should go public with your lies and your unprofessional behavior.
    and if you mean I sell fake parts or fake watches please if someone else have or had a problem with me please post your problem here or on chronotader.
    so I will post now some chat conversation between me and Mr Ninja 2789 and judge your self who tried to make the things complicated and try to ruined my reputation as seller.
     
    IMG_5633.PNG IMG_5634.PNG IMG_5615.PNG IMG_5616.PNG IMG_5617.PNG IMG_5618.PNG IMG_5619.PNG IMG_5620.PNG IMG_5621.PNG IMG_5622.PNG IMG_5623.PNG IMG_5624.PNG IMG_5625.PNG IMG_5627.PNG IMG_5628.PNG IMG_5629.PNG IMG_5630.PNG IMG_5631.PNG IMG_5632.PNG IMG_5633.PNG
  7. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 15, 2018

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    @Amer ,
    Its about time you reply publicly...where have you been hiding out? Ive posted all the details of our transaction in multiple posts on CT, yet you have failed to respond despite multiple requests from other members. Amer, let stick to the FACTS. Your story seems to change every time you respond. First, as you are well aware I did not contact you 6 months after I received the parts. Furthermore, you are well aware your parts were subsequently sent directly to my watchmaker. I contacted you the moment he put your parts on his bench. My full story can be found here:
    ORIGINAL STORY:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/heuer/index.cgi?page=2;md=read;id=89095
    CRYSTAL:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/heuer/index.cgi?md=read;id=89221
    CHRONO HAND:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/heuer/index.cgi?md=read;id=89221
    HANDS:
    http://chronocentric.com/forums/heuer/index.cgi?md=read;id=89219

    Not once have you replied to any of these posts...and you have ignored all of my emails. Is this how a legitimate dealer behaves?

    NO AMER, I simply want the parts I paid for. I am very satisfied with the price I paid assuming they are exactly what you described. Unfortunately they are not...and this is not debatable. The facts speak for themselves.

    First lets review your lies...these are all in your own words, so I would love to understand how you are justified lying about your parts, ignoring the facts and failing to respond to multiple emails:

    YOUR LIES
    This is your listing and your images:
    http://www.chronocentric.com/forums/chronotrader/index.cgi?md=read;id=74356
    Your own description states:
    "for sale Vintage original Heuer Autavia 2446 3rd Execution ,Bezel,glass,hands and Crown with stem"
    "hands New Old stock with tritium"

    Lie #1- This is not an "original Heuer 2446 3rd Execution" crystal. (see 1st image below- as pointed out by my Watchmaker, this crystal will not fit a Autavia or a Carrera)
    Lie #2- These are not "original Heuer 2446 3rd Execution" hands. (see image #2 below)
    Lie #3- This is not an "original Heuer 2446 3rd Execution" crown. (wrong size as verified by the two leading authorities on Heuer)
    Lie #4- The hands are
    defiantly not "New Old Stock" (well, you be the Judge...then explain why your story changed and suddenly these were replaced during service)

    Lie #5- When I was informed that the crystal would not fit my Rindt by my Watchmaker, I immediately emailed Amer and received this response/lie:
    "Very strange to heard this now that the crystal is not correct , the parts that I send it for you was mounted on a Autavia Rindt !!!!!!!"
    Well Amer, this is simply impossible. You are getting real good at this lying...but it gets better.

    Lie #6- My watchmaker next inform my the hands are not correct. Again, I emailed Amer and get this interesting response:
    “Very strange to heard this… the parts that I send it for you was mounted on a Autavia Rindt !!!!!!!”

    “I offer only parts that I‘m sure they are mounted on a watch , Heuer used not always for 1 reference the same parts and if you search google under Heuer Autavia Rindt you will notice how many different hands are mounted for the Rindt , those parts that you bought from me was mounted on my Rindt that I serviced on tag Heuer and received the old parts .”


    Hmm…so it seems these hands are not “new old stock” as advertised…but rather they were removed during a service by TAG Heuer. This brings up many questions to me…foremost why would the seller allow these hands to be replaced during service if they were original or NOS?

    But the big question is what kind of dealer would consider these hands NOS...look at my last image, a macro of the hands Amer shipped. Now compare it to the image in Amer's For Sale post and notice how he cleverly photographed the hands to look new..

    At this point Amer stopped replying to my emails...clearly busted in his scam he simply refused to reply.

    Amer, it is quite clear that you lied and deceived me...in my part of the world we have a term for people like you. We refer to dishonest dealers as Scumbags. You sir are a scumbag. You can spin the story as you like, but your own photos and your own words are quite clear.
     
    MVC_004S.jpg hands.jpg L1000662_2.jpg
    Edited Mar 16, 2018
  8. Amer

    Amer Mar 16, 2018

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    those are not the Hands that I sold you sorry ,the sweep white hands you got it from me for free......you try only to get your money Back cause you noticed that you paid too much,Crown is 100%original Rindt mounted the same in my 2 watches......and Bezel also and crystal.......make sure next time when you buy something don`t change your mind after 6 Months............like you I have too many Buyer who try to buy something and later they take the loupe and found something that want claim to get some money Back.we talk here about vintage parts and not a new stuff and 100% those are not the Hands you bought from me.......
     
  9. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 16, 2018

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    LOL, So now the hands are not the same? You honestly think Ive wasted my time and reputation swapping out your hands to concoct this elaborate story?
    These are the exact hands you shipped as they are the only pair I have and this can be confirmed by my watchmaker.

    As I stated in multiple emails these will "mount' on a Rindt, they are just not original to a Rindt...there is a huge difference, which you clearly cant comprehend. Just because they are "Heuer" hands...doesnt mean they are as you described. Your own photos will confirm that these hands are not correct for a 3rd Execution "Rindt". The value difference is huge.

    Your descriptions are complete and utter lies, there is no place for you in a Forum of honest collectors.
     
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  10. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Mar 16, 2018

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    BTW- Thanks for reminding me about the sweep...which was NOT FREE. I paid over $500 for what you stated was a "NOS Rindt Sweep"

    LIE # 7:
    This is a joke...you found a similar looking sweep in the parts bin and repainted it. Not correct for a Rindt and most certainly not original to any Autavia. Another rip off by the scumbag dealer Amer Sibai.
     
    Chrono_sweepsm.jpg
    Edited Mar 16, 2018
  11. Ninja2789

    Ninja2789 Mar 17, 2018

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    Thanks for sharing your experience CajunTiger. And I'm glad that Amer has responded because I find it hilarious that he feels he's in the right here.

    Just so everyone understands, I asked for $200 back for what were obviously fake hands. His solution was to send me $1000 in hands so I could sell them and recoup my money. . . . .

    Forgive me if I feel I do not want to put another collector in the same position here.
     
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  12. flame

    flame Speedmaster Neil Mar 18, 2018

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    Hi

    Wow - Sounds more like a nigerian scammer than a dealer to me....:)

    Best - Neil
     
  13. DLT222

    DLT222 Double D @ ΩF Staff Member Mar 19, 2018

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    Its safe to say that @Amer will not be selling on here...

    EVER!!!!
     
    watchdaddy1, aap and CajunTiger like this.
  14. sdre

    sdre Apr 19, 2018

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    Bump. Just a heads up if u guys are thinking of getting ug from amer. Don't.

    Always buy the seller.
     
    DLT222 likes this.
  15. Xeer

    Xeer Apr 19, 2018

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    He keeps having UG pieces come in that are tempting. But this thread reins it in for me. Always buy the seller indeed.