Forums Latest Members

Alternatives for 5196P Calatrava

  1. gostang9 May 5, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    Hi all,

    As I spend more time squirreling down into this rabbit hole of watches, I find myself drawn to the modern PP 5196P Calatrava.

    I know I’m a late-comer and there are many of you here that discovered the allure of this look many years ago. In order to avoid triggering an almost certain divorce, (if I suggested putting down the kind of coin this watch requires) I’m hoping some of you can enlighten me with alternatives that have a very similar look for a fraction of the price.

    Criteria
    - 37 to 42mm (I know, I know, such dimensions are too big for many of you, please respect my nonsensical wish... I simply don’t like wearing watches below 38mm in size, so I’ve already made a concession to allow 37!! ;) )
    - small seconds at 6
    - alpha numeric hour markers (can be 12, 3 and 9 only)
    - no date
    - modern or vintage
    - respected brand, but no limitations
    - no cheap ‘homage’ like Parnis, etc (should go without saying I guess)
    - prefer the look of a two-tone dial, definitely not a solid bright white dial
    - manual or auto
    - price between $2k and $6k USD

    I’ve searched through the full Nomos lineup thinking that was a likely solution, but I didn’t find any with the softer tone I love about the 5196P. I’ve also searched JLC with no luck.

    Maybe I’m looking for the impossible?

    Here’s an image of the 5196P from the PP website:
    31F5088B-4C98-485D-A7D3-3B85201E5109.jpeg

    Here’s something with the perfect ‘vibe’ I’m drawn to currently in the FS section on OF in the form of a vintage Longines (price much higher than I’d like for a regular wear watch, and a bit small at 35mm):
    26006582-FA45-49A6-B221-4324FE98146C.jpeg
     
  2. ulackfocus May 5, 2018

    Posts
    25,983
    Likes
    26,968
    So, here's how this kind of situation goes.... You ask for advice on how to find the poor man's version of the ___________ (fill in Patek, Vacheron, DuFour, etc.). You get several options. You try the first, then the second, then the third.... and so on, until you've spent nearly as much money as a pre-owned version of the watch you REALLY want costs and realize it was a waste because you were NEVER satisfied.

    Take it from me, a guy who's been on forums over a decade, in this hobby even longer, and went through the same thing: just start saving for the 5196. Tell your wife even! She'll laugh and blow it off. It might take a few years of brown bagging it and pinching pennies, but in the end it will be worth it once you strap that puppy on your wrist!
     
    Xeer, Screwbacks, shishy and 11 others like this.
  3. 77deluxe May 5, 2018

    Posts
    2,058
    Likes
    4,613
    That is really fantastic advice.
     
    dxholdren likes this.
  4. dxholdren May 5, 2018

    Posts
    98
    Likes
    116
    I second the advice above. Plus there’s just nothing like the 5196P. Start saving for the grail! I’m saving for mine! Perpetual Calendar from the Louis Brandt Collection
     
  5. ulackfocus May 5, 2018

    Posts
    25,983
    Likes
    26,968
    Forgot to mention I really dig the 5127R.

    Patek 5127R.png

    Not so much that I want to spend $20,000+ on it though! Luckily, I have my birth year Eterna 3000 Ultra-thin to satisfy the clean rose gold dress watch slot.

    164193-b02ec4ccf7e27675691d99e355a987a4.jpg
     
  6. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    Well, so far I have yet to "get several options"... ;)

    I understand your logic, and if the PP was 'the' watch for me, I would plunk down the coin for it. However, I love variety and get much more enjoyment if I spend a fraction on multiple lesser alternatives then getting one ultimate watch.

    Case in point, I would love a birth year 6263 big red Daytona panda, but I cannot stomach putting down >$60k for one. I found the 3569.31 2004 LE as a suitable alternate and looked for one of those. I eventually decided on a dial mod to achieve the same look without the LE price tag. In this case I happily went for an alternate of an alternate because it meant I could wear a quality watch with similar look for less than 10% of the 'real' 6263. (please ignore chrono mention, I don't want to get side-tracked, only want to point out my preference for lower cost alternatives over the ultimate watch)

    I completely understand this compromise and I want to find a similar suitable alternate.

    Financially, I could pull the necessary funds out of our savings for the 5196 today, but it's not something I have any desire to do. Suggesting it to the wife is absolutely out of the question, she would undoubtedly expect me to find a compromise (after all, she had many options and settled for me 15 years ago...!! ::psy::)
     
  7. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    I'm sitting at MUC with a short layover today and stopped by one of the NOMOS counters to see their offerings in the flesh. I think the NOMOS Club Aqua might scratch the itch (definitely more 'modern' without the vintage or high-end charm) at a very reasonable ~$3k USD. I like the small pops of orange and the dial looks a little more creamy off-white in person than in the stock website photo (below).
    NOMOS 775-club-automat-datum-3d-front.jpg
     
  8. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    There's also the ETA 6498 route of having a watch put together with a similar look (much like @JimInOz did recently).

    I found the following dial on Ottofrei (and I guess there are likely other alternatives...)
    http://www.ofrei.com/page1267.html

    Ottofrei 6498-1 dial - looks like PP 5196P.jpg
     
  9. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
  10. STANDY schizophrenic pizza orderer and watch collector May 6, 2018

    Posts
    16,311
    Likes
    44,718
    gostang9 likes this.
  11. ulackfocus May 6, 2018

    Posts
    25,983
    Likes
    26,968
    @gostang9 - I will give you the ultimate alternative:

    http://www.rgmwatches.com

    Call Roland at RGM and have him make you a custom watch. They do have a 37 - 38mm case like the style of the Patek. He can make it out of whatever metal you wish. Then you can work with him on the design of the dial, and what caliber (virtually ANY caliber, vintage or modern) you want powering it.

    Their model 25 or 250 might suit you perfectly.
     
    gostang9 likes this.
  12. STANDY schizophrenic pizza orderer and watch collector May 6, 2018

    Posts
    16,311
    Likes
    44,718
    If you didn't have the weird "can't wear under 37 " thing going on.

    There is endless vintage

    image.jpeg

    image.jpeg

    Longines
    image.jpeg

    Alpina
    image.jpeg
     
  13. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    Now that’s along the lines of what I’m looking for! Thank you!
     
  14. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    Yes, I know. I see so many gorgeous watches under that size and try as I might, I cannot get myself to pull the trigger.

    I did recently purchase a 35mm 666 diver that is currently being serviced and then I may put it in a Bund strap to ‘bulk it up’... (sacrilege maybe? Please don’t whittle the stake and light the fire just yet...). ;)
     
  15. ulackfocus May 6, 2018

    Posts
    25,983
    Likes
    26,968
    Okay, we'll just sharpen the pitchforks.

    My pleasure! After perusing RGM's site, I see they have 38.5mm, 40mm, and 42mm options for the case style you like.
     
  16. gostang9 May 6, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
  17. gostang9 Jun 5, 2018

    Posts
    2,668
    Likes
    7,103
    So a deal has been struck for my first vintage Omega and also first simple time-only small-seconds watch.

    @Nathan1967 suggested @Holma20 who helped facilitate a pending sale on this lovely “bullseye” to be picked up F2F in about a month from now.

    The warnings not to ‘settle’ may well come true, but I think this will be a long-term keeper even if I eventually lose all my marbles and spring for the real 5196.

    Image from seller:

    04946722-323B-4DDD-B84A-B95BEB077E12.jpeg
     
    GregH and adi4 like this.
  18. rkman11 Jun 5, 2018

    Posts
    1,677
    Likes
    5,581
    First thought was Nomos. I’d say relook at the Orion line, and if you have an AD near you, go and try a few on.
     
  19. Rman Jun 5, 2018

    Posts
    2,408
    Likes
    9,485
    Nice 2639:thumbsup:
     
  20. w154 Jun 5, 2018

    Posts
    2,532
    Likes
    5,454
    If the Patek’s Breguet numerals are something you’re drawn too then maybe search for vintage Movado. Some really nice examples and they’re quite often two-tone dials.

    Edit to add... maybe something this one I just found on IG (user: theydid)

    2F784E3E-3518-449D-A030-C7BB3968D128.jpeg
     
    Edited Jun 5, 2018
    Eve, rfordo, ANALOGUE and 2 others like this.