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Omega Cal 601 strage looking hands

hoipolloi
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U ulackfocus
Hoi, there's a thread on WUS (that I can't access) talking about some of the late 60's Seamasters where we talked about the difference between having one T and two T's alongside the SWISS MADE. Desmond made a comment about it being the amount of lume used. A couple of the examples shown had lume on the hands but not on the dial and had only T.

Dennis, what I need is picture and proof.

You can have a week or more to search for it, and if it is so rare that you cannot find it anywhere , you should consider it never exists.


ps Lots of guys told me the same , but no one can come up with anything.
 
gatorcpa
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hoipolloi hoipolloi
Dennis, what I need is picture and proof.

You can have a week or more to search for it, and if it is so rare that you cannot find it anywhere , you should consider it never exists.

ps Lots of guys told me the same , but no one can come up with anything.

See this website:

http://www.fhs.ch/en/faq.php#swiss

From the Federation of the Swiss Watch Industry (FHS).

This should be proof enough,
gatorcpa
 
hoipolloi
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A novice in omega collecting should know it. (I read that too many times Gator)

What I need to see is a dial with no lume but there is one (or two) T on it, next to Swiss Made because the hands were lumed .

==============================

Dennis--Well, not necessarily - I've seen original watches with lume on one but not the other. If I recall correctly, some mid 60's De Villes had lumed hands without lume on the dial.

Let me see what I can dig up. I could swear some of the regular Seamasters also had lume on the hands but not the dial (or vice versa). Check back later.

Pretty sure it was one T.

Hoi_You mean no lume on the dial but there was one T next to Swiss Made ? (Swiss Made T ?)

Dennis_ I think that's it. Can't really check right now at work.

 
hoipolloi
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Gator.

English is my second language and when I read this sentence

"In order for timepieces to be read in the dark, a luminescent material is laid on the dial indexes and hands"


http://www.fhs.ch/en/faq.php#swiss

I understand that hands and indexes will have some luminescent on them to help people tell time in the dark.

There is no possibility that the indexes are lumed and the hands are not, because you cannot tell time in the dark if you can't see the hands. (well, some idiots frankened their watches that way but no watch has come out of the factories like that).

The thing to consider here is "is it possible that a watch that has lumed hands and no lume on indexes ? " and that is what I am waiting to see.

Anybody who has something looks like that, please share your pics..

Thank you and best regards.

Hoi.
 
gatorcpa
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hoipolloi hoipolloi
Gator.

English is my second language and when I read this sentence

"In order for timepieces to be read in the dark, a luminescent material is laid on the dial indexes and hands"


http://www.fhs.ch/en/faq.php#swiss

I understand that hands and indexes will have some luminescent on them to help people tell time in the dark.

There is no possibility that the indexes are lumed and the hands are not, because you cannot tell time in the dark if you can't see the hands. (well, some idiots frankened their watches that way but no watch has come out of the factories like that).

The thing to consider here is "is it possible that a watch that has lumed hands and no lume on indexes ? " and that is what I am waiting to see.

Anybody who has something looks like that, please share your pics..

Thank you and best regards.

Hoi.

Hoi -

I believe that dials with one "T" were made prior to the 1963 ISO standardization mentioned in the above article. I've actually seen a dial (Elgin) with an "Ra Swiss Ra" designation for Radium.

I had to think about this for awhile and I do have a watch with lume on the dial and none on the hands. Not an Omega, but a Universal Geneve Polerouter.

DSCN0112.jpg

I agree with you that logically it makes no sense to have a watch like this. Totally useless in the dark. However, given the rarity of replacement parts for this model, I tend to think that the hands are correct, if not original (they are very well aged, like the dial). Length, width and style are similar to other Ref. 204610/1 examples, both with and without lume on the dial. Yes, I know the crystal is not original. I had the signed original crystal replaced as it was cracked. This may have caused the interesting patina on the dial.

Also agree that I've never seen an Omega with original luminous hands without lume on the dial.

Sorry for the confusion,
gatorcpa
 
hoipolloi
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Thanks Gator.

You are right, Omega started to use T (or 2T's) next to Swiss Made in 1963 or 64, starting with watches powered by movements with serial 21 mil.
Here are some lumed dials that powered by 20 mil movements.

Hiddencrown004005.jpg

conste18k027-1.jpg

Then we see Swiss Made T on the Constellation 168.005, 167.005 and 2T's on the 168.004 which were powered by 21 mil (or higher) movements.
The Seamasters also had only one T for a short time before changing to 2T's.

For the redialers, copying the correct fonts and scripts is not hard, but how to apply the correct fonts, scripts and those T's on the dials correctly is very, very hard and they need knowledge, experience to do it properly.

I also have doubt about one T or 2T's relating with the amount of tritium they used.
People love to say that one T means less tritium and 2T's means more, to me it's not correct.

6168014607_82c6a353b9.jpg

6278093421_792c4fa71c_z.jpg

because by looking at these dials, we cannot tell which one has more and which has less tritium.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
well, I should keep some "secrets" for myself, should I ?


Best.
 
MSNWatch
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The transition to the T marking did occur at that time - the speedmasters mirror this - case ref. 105.002 had no T and the next reference, 105.003 had the T marking. Since the consensus is that the 105.002 reference was produced for only a few months at the end of 1962, it is safe to say that 1963 was the year this transition in lume marking happened.
Here is my photographic contribution to this thread - an early hidden crown connie (notice the stepped bezel) with an original piepan black dial.
5215338396_454cf297fc_z.jpg
 
hoipolloi
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Hi Mike
Very nice and rare black dial 004. It must be powered by a 561 in 20 mil range ?
I have a question for you "Have you ever seen a piepan dial without a crosshair on these 004's ?

Best
 
MSNWatch
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Hoi,
Yes 561 with 20m movement.
Page 367 Omega Journey Through Time book on your other question.
Mike
 
MSNWatch
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You've got to get it Hoi - well worth the money! Invaluable as a reference especially now that the online vintage omega database is no longer as informative as it once was.
 
J
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Gents....found this one. Picture is not that good but the hands look pretty much the same as my first photo.
 
fotosm.JPG
U
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MSNWatch MSNWatch
You've got to get it Hoi - well worth the money! Invaluable as a reference especially now that the online vintage omega database is no longer as informative as it once was.

I'll second that. My personal little Santa got me it for Christmas a few years ago and it's great.
 
hoipolloi
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Hi Janbart.

omega8a-jpg.2168


Do you see the lume dots at the ends of the indexes ? The other one doesn't count because it's a redial.

Hi Mike & Dennis.

I will get it someday but not now. a few more years, I guess.
 
MSNWatch
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Getting it earlier might save you more money down the road...
 
U
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hoipolloi hoipolloi
Hi Mike & Dennis.

I will get it someday but not now. a few more years, I guess.

I think you get it better than me Hoi. 😉
 
hoipolloi
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Maybe because I don't read it, I have a different approach and go my own path. It may cost me more money (Mike said) and time to go my own way but so far, I am happy with my decision.
Certainly, it will be a big surprise for me the day I read it .

Best.
 
J
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Yeah I can see the dots. You guys made it clear. Thanks. So I may conclude the hands on my watch (first pic) are not genuine. Thanks a lot.
JB
 
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