This watch has already reached a bid beyond its value.

The dial looks bold, but is a redial.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Uni...499527228?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item418aade83cPurchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

 

I do not share your opinion. The dial looks original to me.

 

Not a UG guy, but the printing on the dial is way to crisp to be a redial, looks perfectly original to me.

 

I think one should be very careful making posts such as one by Modest Proposal above.
Why spoiling someone's chance to sell a nice watch? First telling any who might be interested that the price is too high and then stating the dial is not original. Not cool in my book.

 

If you do not feel that there is something wrong with making such posts then I have nothing to ad.
All I said: one should be careful making certain claims about another's watch offered for sale.
I did not say one should not express one's opinion. I often question the motive of such posts.
It would be very helpful to know what is the expertise of one making such statement and what in particular led them to arrive at their opinion that the dial is not original.

 

O.K. this is the kind of post would would have expected from the start. An opinion backed by some details.
I still do not agree but it is often difficult to judge the dial just from the scans. Seeing the texture of the background would be helpful. I have seen original dials with ink applied thick above the surface of the dial. The ink here is very precise and uniform. I do not see any pitting. It stays in straight lines and the lines are of uniform width.
Here are a few of my dials where the dial maker, and there were just a few, used both round 3 top as well as flat 3 sometimes in the same dial.

 

you are making a good case not definitive in my opinion yet...
Your posts are the kind that I always welcome and want to read.

 

If you are suggesting that I am trying to dissuade potential buyers on this forum from bidding in order to score a good deal, I am frankly shocked.

As has been stated by other members of this forum, calling out items that are for sale, either for advertisement or for warning, is one of the most common activities on this forum. With the number of posts you've posted on this site, I'd think you'd be aware of that.

The bold overinking and indices encroaching the subdials are signs of a redial. If you look closely at the subdials, you'll also notice the edges are soft - which is also an indication of a redial.

I should have stated the reasons for my suspicions, but I didn't think I was going to be so bluntly attacked. I just wanted to warn people who might be less familiar with UG.

 

If you saw my post as an attack I am sorry. This was not my intent.
Not all vintage watches are available with original mint dials. I thought the watch was nice and I would not mind having one. Obviously viewing it in person is preferred over seeing it on the screen to make a definite judgement on the dial. The seller did not make a representation as to dial being original or not. As to the value, the e-bay market decided what it should be at this time and this auction. Myself, I would not make a post stating the price is too high while the auction is still in progress.
If this is the culture here, then fine.

 

Afinewatch,

Alright. That's just how I felt, but I will recognize what you've said.

Nobody expects vintage watches to have mint dials. What collectors predominantly look for, however, are original dials. I've dealt with Universal Geneve watches for a good long time now and I'm essentially completely convinced that this is a redial.

This is true, but considering the importance collectors give to original dials, it is the obligation, I believe, for a seller to clarify the presence of a redial for those who are not as experienced with the brand. You, for example, and others on this forum were under the impression that the dial was original and would have bid according to the value of an original piece. Withholding information because its revealing would harm your auction is as bad as lying.

Again, new collectors or people unfamiliar with a brand or model can ignorantly pay far more than a piece is worth to the community as a whole. You can't look at the Ebay history of photoshopped horrors or frankenwatches reaching absurd prices and tell me they bought it at the correct value. They've obviously been screwed over by people who know better. All it takes is two individuals who overestimate the value of an item and the price can reach the sky and beyond. Others just shake their heads.

 

I believe e-bay is for adults to spend their money as they wish. Not all buyers are collectors and not all collectors must have an original dial. Not all sellers are very educated as to originality of the dial either.
It is possible this seller did not know and therefore did not address this issue in their auction. Auctions are typically run over the period of 7 to 10 days. Plenty of time to ask the seller any questions important to one or ask others for an opinion. I came upon your post just by chance. To me it was totally unimportant if this watch had original dial or not. I was not about to buy it. If a watch like this was presented to me in person and the price was right I would buy it. The dial was very presentable.
The originality of the dial is not a deal killer for me. I enjoy vintage watches for more than just their dials.
There are over 250,000 watches offered on e-bay at any given time. Surely most watches are not offered to collectors? Any seller is free to offer anything they have for sale with as little or as much information as they have or are willing to share. It is up to the buyer to ask for more or pass it by. E-bay is a Bazaar with good and some not so good sellers. Buyer beware.

 

I just hope the world can switch to the other side of caveat emptor. I have never sold my watches though but if I ever intend to sell one, I will try to declare and describe to the best of my ability with accuracy the condition as a seller. I think many on this forum will do the same.

 

Yes,

This is a collector's forum. I posted my findings on a collector's forum. I am dealing with collectors.

 

Yup! And keep on posting your findings... and calling out the redials as you see them. Then we can all learn something and enjoy the debate. Though in this case, there's no doubt that this is a redial.

It's true that some watch buyers prefer the clean looks of a redial, but others--including many around here--do not. Hence we have this forum where potential buyers, collectors, (and sellers), can come to learn more about their watch or the watch that they are contemplating.

 

When next perusing the For Sale Forums, I for one will certainly be keeping this in mind.